Cornbread Red and 'The Rack'

[NH Steve]

I recently put up Red's One Pocket Hall of Fame page, thanks to photos and material sent to me by Red's son-in-law, Steve Lomako. It can be found here:
Billy Cornbread Red Burge (http://onepocket.org/CornbreadHOFpage.htm)

Steve also added a few comments about Red's haunt in Detroit: The Rack was really the "Capital Billiards Club" in Oak Park, MI on the border of Detroit, how it started to be called The Rack I don't know. Gil Elias bought it in 1966 and there was always action there. It was frequented by alot of well known people, there was a steam room across the street "The Stanley Steamer" that brought money people and sports personalities around.

The action started getting real big and there was a raid in about 1973 where around 90 people were arrested. Two or three of the older guys suffered "heart attacks" during the raid. Gil and the "heart attack" victims sued the county and city, any and all charges were dropped and Gil was granted a private club license in return for dismissing the lawsuits. After that the place became "untouchable" and the gambling became rampant and through the roof.

You have to know that Oak Park was a tight knit Jewish community with a lot of money around from them, the Italians, the Blacks in Detroit and other groups. Each one always trying to outdo the other and it just got more and more insane moneywise.

It continued that way up until it closed down in 1986...
...Even with all of the other action rooms around the country at various times in L.A., New Orleans and Baton Rouge, Chicago, Miami, Pittsburg, Philly, etc.................The Rack in Detroit was ALWAYS considered the "MECCA" for every champion and road player in the country, the "Promised Land" if you could win and Cornbread was absolutely the King there, bar none.

It'd be nice to do a book about the old action rooms over the years around the country starting back in Norfolk, VA during the war when it really began.

Thanks, Steve!

[OldHasBeen]

There never has been or ever will be a room like The Rack OR a Pool Player like RED.
I spent about 5 or 6 winters there. I THINK it was the opening of the Toledo racetrack that started off the pool/gambling season every year. Within 2 days of the main characters coming into the Rack - The place filled up with pool hustlers from all over the country. Buddy was the one who brought me to Detroit for the first time and introduced me to Red within 10 min. Buddy & I were in on the ca$h so Buddy was instructing me on NEVER give Red any money. He said Red was the Best Bitter in the world. As he was telling me this - Red comes up behind Buddy and asks Buddy for $300. Buddy almost broke his arm getting out the $300 to give to Red.
Red Truly ran the pool action in Detroit.
If you weren’t square with Red - You didn't get any action! "And he didn't allow any Nits"!
One of my fondest memories of Red & Detroit was one day that Buddy & I went to pick up Red at his house. As we waited downstairs - the movie "The Hustler" was on TV. Red came running down half dressed and started screaming at Fatty and the TV all about their many games. It was like a 30 min Stand Up Routine and Buddy & I laughed our ass off.
I also had many conversations with GIL during the slow morning hours and some of the Purple Gang Rum Running stories were amazing. I've never seen Gil get as upset as the night Ritchie Ambrose won over $300K and refused to pay the mandatory 10% for time. The other 2 involved (backers) had no problem and gladly paid. It seems like a lot but as Gil said - Listen, we have the FBI sitting across the street every night and if you think I'm going to take all this HEAT for nothing - Your Nuts! Ritchie didn't pay and got barred. He went to Houston and 3 months later he was broke. I don't think he ever realized what almost happened to him that night - Gil Was HOT and connected.
As I've said before - One of my biggest scores was a piece, of a piece, of a side bet. My end was over $17K that night. There was a (BarButh?) dice game every Monday night and one time this fellow comes in with a Samsonite briefcase and wants to bet whats inside. Freddy tells him "Your Covered" and he rolls the dice and losses. Freddy opens up the briefcase and it had over $250K inside.
I used to go over to the Stanley Steamer about 3 or 4 days a week. They had one of the best Jewish/Russian Steam rooms I've ever seen. It had a big oven on one wall with hot rocks. You could press a button and water would spray onto the rocks. You could also get a Plaice. After I would get wrapped in a sheet and go out to the TV room and relax in a big recliner and rest until my Steak was done to perfection.
I could go on for days about the Detroit Days, Red, the action and the games I saw but I will say - My days in Detroit were some of the fondest memories of my entire pool carrier.

TY & GL

Ps - There was also a lot of action at other poolrooms and bars back then. I got a ton of action at a poolroom on W. Varner av.(The Chat'nShoot, I think) and made real good scores at local bars almost everynight. The action at The Rack didn't get going until at least 2 or 3 in the morning.
One of the funniest things I remember is this little Jewish guy would walk up to the Deli every morning at about 5 am and get fresh donuts, bagels and cream cheese to bring back to The Rack. On his way back - he would always stop at The FBI van across the street and drop off a bag of donuts and some hot coffee.

Steve - I really enjoyed the photos and article! That slip-stroke of Red's was deadly.

[fred bentivegna]

Excerpt from my Bank Book,

The great, Billy "Corn-Bread-Red" Burge, of Detroit, MI. He played as high as anybody. Red was one of my heroes. Whenever I ran into him, I hung on to him the whole time. I was totally fascinated by him. I followed him everywhere but into the bathroom. He was another master at shooting off the money ball. Red, when confronted with the big-cheese-money-ball, would snort derisively at his opponent, "Haw, haw," in his inimitable style. He would then increase his normally long back stroke about another foot, and slip-stroke the shot in, with dust flying out of the back of the pocket. Red was unbeatable playing One-Pocket on a 5 x 10 snooker table. He was a great hustler, a great player, a joy to watch -- almost as funny as Minnesota Fats -- a scandalous, shameless rogue, and I dearly miss him so.

I will never forget a conversation I had with Billy Johnson (Wade Crane) in Detroit. We were talking about Red. Billy said,"Let's enjoy Red while we can, because there will never be another one like him."
the Beard

(This is by far, my favorite photo.)

[jazznpool]

First time I got to watch Red play was during the summer of 1969 when I first started hanging around a pool room in East Detroit, Kelly's Kue. I was 15 at the time. At about 1 or 2am a buddy and myself went to a place in Hamtramyk called Peck's Coney Island. They had about 3 tables in the place. At the time guys like Pittsburgh John, Ronnie Reynolds, Red and other players were coming there. Red was strutting around with his hands in his pocket, eyes darting around (trademark Red), looking for action when someone mentioned that he might match up with a guy called "the green hornet." Red quickly turned toward the guy who suggested the match up and said "the green hornet? myyyy mutha fu&#ing aaaaass." He said it Southern style, and real slow and with emphasis on each word. It was so funny! We went there several times that summer to sweat the action.

Been to the rack several times from early 70's until 81. Played after hours there a few times. Its funny but the one odd thing I recall about the place were the tattered and duct taped lazy-boy chairs with guys like Cecil sleeping in them. I've watched Red play one-pocket behind his back for hours on end. He was like a human pretzel. It was amazing the shots he could come with that way.

In about 1980 or 1981 he was hanging around Playland Recreation on 10 Mile and Kelly Rd. in East Detroit for a few weeks. It was a place that had many good shortstops and a few good players who would gamble. The owner, Paul G., staked Red to play me (race to 3) of one pocket for 250.00 a set. I think I got 11-5 and got to have a coach (Tommy Lazlo who went up with me). I was a little intimidated playing Red but I won 2 sets and the owner pulled up. I actually didn't want to play but Little Tommy said "get up there" so I did.

Detroit trivia: Speaking of Hamtramyk does anyone remember who "Rocking Chair Helen Mcgowan" was? Hamtramyk used to have good bar pool action.

There was a great article about Red in the Detroit Free Press Sunday Magazine in early 1969. It would be worth searching the archives for and I'd love to read it again myself. There's several photos including one of Red and his (pink?) Cadillac.

Martin

[stevelomako]

The "Green Hornet" was Dickie "the Hornet" Mazzi (RIP),

I would NEVER EVER sit in the lazyboy at the Rack cause it had all that head grease all over the top, it was sick. I would lay down on the park bench and use a phone book as a pillow, it was alot cleaner and comfortable.

The funniest thing I remember about the chair was when John "Barline" Beyerlin (RIP) was sleeping in it one night and had his hand resting on his chest...Ronnie Allen walks by him and says "look at this motherfucker, OUT like a light and IN with everybody!"

I really miss Tommy Lazlo (RIP), hard to believe he was shot sitting in his car in a gas station using a payphone.

I'll ask about "Rocking chair Helen", never heard of her that I can remember but I'll find out.

I think I have the magazine you're talking about, if I do I'll make some copies and bring them to DCC.

So who the hell are you?, I have to know you.

[jazznpool]

Steve, I'm the guy who lives in California that hangs around Larry Ross's place once a year when visiting family and friends. If you saw me you would recognize me. I visted your room last year with Batman when you weren't there. I think your daughter was on duty. It's a nice room with good equipment. I also said hello to you at the DCC last year (Ill see you there this year if you go). Rocking Chair Helen is also known as the Motor City Madam. Word had it she was once John Dillingers's girlfriend.

BTW who was "dancer" or "danzer"? He was coming around Peck's about that time too. Detroit was/is a great pool town. I used to hear player stories from an old Italian player (he was in his 70's when I was 16) who hung out at the Hole and the Detroit Recreation.

Martin

The "Green Hornet" was Dickie "the Hornet" Mazzi (RIP),

I would NEVER EVER sit in the lazyboy at the Rack cause it had all that head grease all over the top, it was sick. I would lay down on the park bench and use a phone book as a pillow, it was alot cleaner and comfortable.

The funniest thing I remember about the chair was when John "Barline" Beyerlin (RIP) was sleeping in it one night and had his hand resting on his chest...Ronnie Allen walks by him and says "look at this motherfucker, OUT like a light and IN with everybody!"

I really miss Tommy Lazlo (RIP), hard to believe he was shot sitting in his car in a gas station using a payphone.

I'll ask about "Rocking chair Helen", never heard of her that I can remember but I'll find out.

I think I have the magazine you're talking about, if I do I'll make some copies and bring them to DCC.

So who the hell are you?, I have to know you.

[stevelomako]

Steve, I'm the guy who lives in California that hangs around Larry Ross's place once a year when visiting family and friends. If you saw me you would recognize me. I visted your room last year with Batman when you weren't there. I think your daughter was on duty. It's a nice room with good equipment. I also said hello to you at the DCC last year (Ill see you there this year if you go). Rocking Chair Helen is also known as the Motor City Madam. Word had it she was once John Dillingers's girlfriend.

BTW who was "dancer" or "danzer"? He was coming around Peck's about that time too. Detroit was/is a great pool town. I used to hear player stories from an old Italian player (he was in his 70's when I was 16) who hung out at the Hole and the Detroit Recreation.

Martin

NOW I know who you are, I didn't know you were from Detroit originally.

Thanks about the room, My daughter has been busy this summer decorating and painting, you'd shit walking in the door now. Things are better every day. Doing the tables the second time now so they should be real good after all the years of neglect they had.

Bob Dancer.......I know a few guys on here know him and would have a story or two.

I'll be at DCC, you need to go to the HOF dinner for the best time of the event. I think I'll be able to spot you before you spot me...bet? either way we'll talk there also.

Man, I wish some of Red was on tape, he's STILL the best one to imitate with the funny shit he would come up with. We were just talking tonite about how he's probably give more good players the 7,8 and the break than anybody in the country.

[Cowboy Dennis]

I'm only 3 yrs. 4 mos. late in responding to this post but oh well. I remember Red giving the 7,8,9 and the break to Al Naif. At the time Al was a decent player. I asked Red about this game and he said " I'll give the 7,8,9 and the break to anyone who ain't got a nickname". Al Didn't.

[NH Steve]

<snip>
There was a great article about Red in the Detroit Free Press Sunday Magazine in early 1969. It would be worth searching the archives for and I'd love to read it again myself. There's several photos including one of Red and his (pink?) Cadillac.

MartinSomewhere, I have that article. Thank you for reminding me.

[Cowboy Dennis]

I have a 1988 Detroit News sports section that has Red on the first page. The article is entitled 'Hustlin' in Detroit'. It mentions many players that are gone now, like the 'Muffin Man', Shane, Pittsburgh John, 'Shake&Bake and some others that I'm not sure of, like Taxi Danny. Also mentioned are Chico the Banker, Ice Man, Miami, Cecil the Serpent, Old Man Frog who was a helluva player when I was a young up and comer. It's nice having this paper to read after all these years.

[Fatboy]

Red is my ALL TIME favorite pool player!!, and that aint ever gonna change-I wont live that long.

[jazznpool]

Sometime in early 1981, Red was hanging around Playland Recreation in East Detroit for a week or so. One afternoon, the owner, Paul Gatto, staked Red to play me one pocket shooting behind his back and giving me 11-7/10-7 for $250 a set race to 3. "Little Tommy" Lazlo who was "up" with me was my coach at the table. Red played his ass off but it was a good a game for me and Paul pulled up after losing 2 straight sets. I remember feeling a little shaky when I started off playing because $250 was a decent amount of cheese at the time AND I was playing the mighty Red (or Corn as he was sometimes called). Red was like a circus contortionist bending like a pretzel to shoot. He played for hours like that!

Martin




I'm only 3 yrs. 4 mos. late in responding to this post but oh well. I remember Red giving the 7,8,9 and the break to Al Naif. At the time Al was a decent player. I asked Red about this game and he said " I'll give the 7,8,9 and the break to anyone who ain't got a nickname". Al Didn't.

[Artie Bodendorfer]

Sometime in early 1981, Red was hanging around Playland Recreation in East Detroit for a week or so. One afternoon, the owner, Paul Gatto, staked Red to play me one pocket shooting behind his back and giving me 11-7/10-7 for $250 a set race to 3. "Little Tommy" Lazlo who was "up" with me was my coach at the table. Red played his ass off but it was a good a game for me and Paul pulled up after losing 2 straight sets. I remember feeling a little shaky when I started off playing because $250 was a decent amount of cheese at the time AND I was playing the mightly Red (or Corn as he was sometimes called). Red was like a circus contortionist bending like a pretzel to shoot. He played for hours like that!

Martin You cannot replace the old you can only add to it.

[Cowboy Dennis]

Sometime in early 1981, Red was hanging around Playland Recreation in East Detroit for a week or so. One afternoon, the owner, Paul Gatto, staked Red to play me one pocket shooting behind his back and giving me 11-7/10-7 for $250 a set race to 3. "Little Tommy" Lazlo who was "up" with me was my coach at the table. Red played his ass off but it was a good a game for me and Paul pulled up after losing 2 straight sets. I remember feeling a little shaky when I started off playing because $250 was a decent amount of cheese at the time AND I was playing the mighty Red (or Corn as he was sometimes called). Red was like a circus contortionist bending like a pretzel to shoot. He played for hours like that!

Martin
I saw Tommy Lazlo give Red 9-7 and the break at the Kelly Cue in East Detroit. Only thing was that Tommy flipped a coin for the first break. Red called it and lost so Tommy broke the first game and they alternated after that. After Red got stuck pretty good he remembered that he was supposed to be getting the break. But he was out of money or almost out. So he had Steve Lomako drive to his house and get a re-load and bring it back to him. I don't remember who ended up winning that match but I still remember Red shooting at his hole from the end rail. Not recklessly, just when called for. But he shot very good behind the back.
And the show that he put on when he realized that he had been hoodwinked out of every other break was amazing. He stomped and yelled that he was the dumbest mf-er in the world. It was funny as hell.

[Cowboy Dennis]

You cannot replace the old you can only add to it.
Artie, you have proved once again that brevity is indeed the soul of wit.