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J. Brumback vs. J. Miller 2004 D.C.C.#2

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  • #31
    ------------
    Last edited by John Brumback; 03-23-2012, 02:51 PM. Reason: took it back
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    • #32
      Originally posted by fred bentivegna View Post
      .. Does everybody want to try and learn something here, or would ya'll rather be amused by "Hocker" (Yiddish word, stop hocking mir im chinick) or by the consternation between myself and Dr Bill? I really need to know.

      Beard
      Ok Freddy i will lighten up on you. Just to let you know Freddy, if i didnt like you i wouldnt talk to or needle you. You would get zero attention from me... I do have to give you some constructive criticism though and i hope you can take it. Your knowledge is really good and i can appreciate what it took to dedicate your whole life to this game, but as far as you being an instructor you really have to work on your bedside manner. You take so much offense if anyone disagrees with you. You act like the people from Chicago are the only people who know how to move. 20 or 30 years ago you may have been able to think people from Chicago could outmove the rest of the people, but with technology, accustats, Youtube, live streaming of matches. Times have changed. When people disagree with your shot, i have never seen you take a step back and listen to what they are saying and maybe change your mind. Not you, if someone disagrees with you your defenses go up and you get mad and stick to your shot no matter what. There is a saying.... the dumbest man in the world is the man with all the answers!! think about it Freddy. I have learned some things about both games since i have joined as a member by listening to guys like you, Billy, SJD, etc. You make it real hard to give you a compliment though when you say that your the best mover on earth playing bank pool.. you come off as an arrogant asshole when you say that. When i say things im joking about it, you are dead serious. Just take a few minutes and go watch Michael Jordans Hall of Fame speech. Everyone on the planet knows he was the greatest player ever. They announced him into the Hall of Fame as the greatest player and yet he spent the whole time taking all the credit for everything and bragging. It was the worst Hall of Fame speech in any sport ever. He is my favorite athlete of alltime, yet that speech still makes me sick to my stomache... think about it

      Comment


      • #33
        The best part about this site (for a banger like myself) is when the top players have DIFFERENT views on what they would do in a certain situation. I thoroughly enjoy reading WHY the better players would do this or that.

        When the best banker in the world likes one shot and when one of the great movers/thinkers likes doing something else.... well there's a lot of good info to pick up. Nobody's pissing in the wind, that's for sure.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by onepockethacker View Post
          Ok Freddy i will lighten up on you. Just to let you know Freddy, if i didnt like you i wouldnt talk to or needle you. You would get zero attention from me... I do have to give you some constructive criticism though and i hope you can take it. Your knowledge is really good and i can appreciate what it took to dedicate your whole life to this game, but as far as you being an instructor you really have to work on your bedside manner. You take so much offense if anyone disagrees with you. You act like the people from Chicago are the only people who know how to move. 20 or 30 years ago you may have been able to think people from Chicago could outmove the rest of the people, but with technology, accustats, Youtube, live streaming of matches. Times have changed. When people disagree with your shot, i have never seen you take a step back and listen to what they are saying and maybe change your mind. Not you, if someone disagrees with you your defenses go up and you get mad and stick to your shot no matter what. There is a saying.... the dumbest man in the world is the man with all the answers!! think about it Freddy. I have learned some things about both games since i have joined as a member by listening to guys like you, Billy, SJD, etc. You make it real hard to give you a compliment though when you say that your the best mover on earth playing bank pool.. you come off as an arrogant asshole when you say that. When i say things im joking about it, you are dead serious. Just take a few minutes and go watch Michael Jordans Hall of Fame speech. Everyone on the planet knows he was the greatest player ever. They announced him into the Hall of Fame as the greatest player and yet he spent the whole time taking all the credit for everything and bragging. It was the worst Hall of Fame speech in any sport ever. He is my favorite athlete of alltime, yet that speech still makes me sick to my stomache... think about it
          nice post
          (note smiley face...)

          Comment


          • #35
            A Beard point of view

            Once again, for the umpteenth time I am going to attempt to present my side of it. I spend about 50% of my time on the forum doing this exact same thing. It is a waste of valuable time to say the least.

            First off, I will not put up with anybody criticizing me or my ideas as being old fashioned, "20 or 30 years out of date," nitty, cowardly, etc. Let us not forget I go to DCC every year and have spent a lot of time in the booth observing the recent crop of champions. What the players of today know and do, is no mystery to me.

            You can put my shit in a time capsule and use it in the year 3000. What is never going to change or become "new era" is shooting at 9 footers instead of 3 footers. If I cant get that point established than we have nowhere to go.

            I get frustrated with John B, the world's best straight back shooter, when he continues to suggest that ya'll do the same. I think John is overlooking the fact that the majority of the folks on this site are shortstops and below. People he can play banks 8 to 5 and worse. I believe we would all be better served if he was able to tell us how he makes those 9 footers rather than telling us to keep shooting them.

            I dont want people that are trying to learn, thinking that you cant shut down a straight back shooter with solid moving and defense. Jesus put it best when he said, "Man cannot live by straight-back alone." The forum members are going to have a high rate of success leaving 9 footers to players that dont shoot like Jason Miller or John Brumback. I speak from experience in this area. If you want to watch one of the great straight backers of all time, Truman Hogue, getting strangled by defense, sweat the match he and I played in 1986 at the Billiard Cafe. (Its on my site somewhere)

            Regarding the "arrogant asshole" that I come across as to the Hacker. Too f'n bad. I plead guilty to the arrogant charge, the asshole part is up for further conjecture. My claim to the world's best bank mover is a lot more realistic than his brag of not getting beat in 5 yrs. (Could that statement also be construed as "arrogant?") When he said that, I didnt get upset. I took it as a challenge and suggested he could do something with one of my protege's, Chris Gentile. He refused that request. Maybe he should offer me the same sort of challenge for the next big tourn, and put forth his pick for world's best bank mover.

            Finally, and contrary to his pleas of innocence, for the last 40 years Dr Bill has always enjoyed jerking me around.

            Beard

            With all that off my chest, I am basically cooled out and vitriol free, even with the Hocker.
            New stuff on my site. 100s of pgs. of pool goodness
            www.bankingwiththebeard.com

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by fred bentivegna View Post
              Once again, for the umpteenth time I am going to attempt to present my side of it. I spend about 50% of my time on the forum doing this exact same thing. It is a waste of valuable time to say the least.

              First off, I will not put up with anybody criticizing me or my ideas as being old fashioned, "20 or 30 years out of date," nitty, cowardly, etc. Let us not forget I go to DCC every year and have spent a lot of time in the booth observing the recent crop of champions. What the players of today know and do, is no mystery to me.

              You can put my shit in a time capsule and use it in the year 3000. What is never going to change or become "new era" is shooting at 9 footers instead of 3 footers. If I cant get that point established than we have nowhere to go.

              I get frustrated with John B, the world's best straight back shooter, when he continues to suggest that ya'll do the same. I think John is overlooking the fact that the majority of the folks on this site are shortstops and below. People he can play banks 8 to 5 and worse. I believe we would all be better served if he was able to tell us how he makes those 9 footers rather than telling us to keep shooting them.

              I dont want people that are trying to learn, thinking that you cant shut down a straight back shooter with solid moving and defense. Jesus put it best when he said, "Man cannot live by straight-back alone." The forum members are going to have a high rate of success leaving 9 footers to players that dont shoot like Jason Miller or John Brumback. I speak from experience in this area. If you want to watch one of the great straight backers of all time, Truman Hogue, getting strangled by defense, sweat the match he and I played in 1986 at the Billiard Cafe. (Its on my site somewhere)

              Regarding the "arrogant asshole" that I come across as to the Hacker. Too f'n bad. I plead guilty to the arrogant charge, the asshole part is up for further conjecture. My claim to the world's best bank mover is a lot more realistic than his brag of not getting beat in 5 yrs. (Could that statement also be construed as "arrogant?") When he said that, I didnt get upset. I took it as a challenge and suggested he could do something with one of my protege's, Chris Gentile. He refused that request. Maybe he should offer me the same sort of challenge for the next big tourn, and put forth his pick for world's best bank mover.

              Finally, and contrary to his pleas of innocence, for the last 40 years Dr Bill has always enjoyed jerking me around.

              Beard

              With all that off my chest, I am basically cooled out and vitriol free, even with the Hocker.
              well at least for the moment there is peace and goodwill in the world
              lets hope it stays that way

              Comment


              • #37
                Wow ! Freddy, what a mover you are. You've got them all begging you not to leave.
                Rod.
                P.S. You were never going anywhere.
                Rod.

                Rodney Stephens.
                (e-mail) rod.stephens0105@att.net(e-mail) #713-973-0503 is now working

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by fred bentivegna View Post
                  Once again, for the umpteenth time I am going to attempt to present my side of it. I spend about 50% of my time on the forum doing this exact same thing. It is a waste of valuable time to say the least. The squeeky wheel gets the grease. That's the way the games played, get use to it.

                  First off, I will not put up with anybody criticizing me or my ideas as being old fashioned, "20 or 30 years out of date," nitty, cowardly, etc. Let us not forget I go to DCC every year and have spent a lot of time in the booth observing the recent crop of champions. What the players of today know and do, is no mystery to me. It is easy for people to criticize presumptuous people, especially if their smart, get use to it.

                  You can put my shit in a time capsule and use it in the year 3000. What is never going to change or become "new era" is shooting at 9 footers instead of 3 footers. If I cant get that point established than we have nowhere to go. Very presumptuous statement to make, while stating the obvious. There's reasons why people shoot 9 footers and leave 3 footers, which I won't go into.

                  I get frustrated with John B, the world's best straight back shooter, when he continues to suggest that ya'll do the same. I think John is overlooking the fact that the majority of the folks on this site are shortstops and below. People he can play banks 8 to 5 and worse. I believe we would all be better served if he was able to tell us how he makes those 9 footers rather than telling us to keep shooting them. Now that I will agree with you on. I would like to learn how to make a lot of shots, i'll PM John.

                  I dont want people that are trying to learn, thinking that you cant shut down a straight back shooter with solid moving and defense. Jesus put it best when he said, "Man cannot live by straight-back alone." The forum members are going to have a high rate of success leaving 9 footers to players that dont shoot like Jason Miller or John Brumback. I speak from experience in this area. If you want to watch one of the great straight backers of all time, Truman Hogue, getting strangled by defense, sweat the match he and I played in 1986 at the Billiard Cafe. (Its on my site somewhere) Again you have a valid point, yes you can slow down the best players with solid moving, and defense.

                  Regarding the "arrogant asshole" that I come across as to the Hacker. Too f'n bad. I plead guilty to the arrogant charge, the asshole part is up for further conjecture. My claim to the world's best bank mover is a lot more realistic than his brag of not getting beat in 5 yrs. (Could that statement also be construed as "arrogant?") When he said that, I didnt get upset. I took it as a challenge and suggested he could do something with one of my protege's, Chris Gentile. He refused that request. Maybe he should offer me the same sort of challenge for the next big tourn, and put forth his pick for world's best bank mover. You're on a roll, right again. And you're not an asshole, maybe sometimes but shouldn't be considered one.

                  Finally, and contrary to his pleas of innocence, for the last 40 years Dr Bill has always enjoyed jerking me around. What comes around, goes around.

                  Beard

                  With all that off my chest, I am basically cooled out and vitriol free, even with the Hocker. The time is 10:40 am. Central time March 18th.
                  Yes you have put in over 50 years in the trenches, and imo you are one of the most knowledgeable players in the world, and along with that you're one of the most well liked players in the last 50 years along with being the most stubborn player that I personally know. But that stubborn part can be remedied, just start deferring a little more to what I say, that would be good for openers.

                  Oh, by the way, you're putting too much garlic in your sauce.

                  Dr. Bill< Your favorite doctor.
                  Last edited by wincardona; 03-18-2012, 12:58 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Shhhh...

                    Originally posted by androd View Post
                    Wow ! Freddy, what a mover you are. You've got them all begging you not to leave.
                    Rod.
                    P.S. You were never going anywhere.
                    ...quiet please. Keep that under you hat.

                    Beard
                    New stuff on my site. 100s of pgs. of pool goodness
                    www.bankingwiththebeard.com

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Presumptuous?

                      You can put my shit in a time capsule and use it in the year 3000. What is never going to change or become "new era" is shooting at 9 footers instead of 3 footers. If I cant get that point established than we have nowhere to go. Very presumptuous statement to make, while stating the obvious. There's reasons why people shoot 9 footers and leave 3 footers, which I won't go into.


                      Originally posted by wincardona View Post
                      Yes you have put in over 50 years in the trenches, and imo you are one of the most knowledgeable players in the world, and along with that you're one of the most well liked players in the last 50 years along with being the most stubborn player that I personally know. (You would have a tough time convincing people that I had a harder head than you or Artie, please!) But that stubborn part can be remedied, just start deferring a little more to what I say, that would be good for openers.

                      Oh, by the way, you're putting too much garlic in your sauce.

                      Dr. Bill< Your favorite doctor.
                      You are being presumptuous if you are inferring that I dont think that there are sometimes reasons when someone should shoot at a 9 footer even if they are leaving a 3 footer.
                      I have an offensive situational strategy that goes well beyond what most people think offensive strategy should be. I just dont ever get much chance to present it. I always believe that you should first understand what is bad before you make a determination as to what is good.
                      As far as I am concerned It still hasnt yet been firmly established that there is any advantage to shooting at shots that have less distance to travel.

                      Beard

                      I am done here. Now it is time to stir my Sunday sauce made with Lamb bones. It makes a sauce richer than Donald Trump.
                      Last edited by fred bentivegna; 03-19-2012, 07:17 AM.
                      New stuff on my site. 100s of pgs. of pool goodness
                      www.bankingwiththebeard.com

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by fred bentivegna View Post
                        You can put my shit in a time capsule and use it in the year 3000. What is never going to change or become "new era" is shooting at 9 footers instead of 3 footers. If I cant get that point established than we have nowhere to go. Very presumptuous statement to make, while stating the obvious. There's reasons why people shoot 9 footers and leave 3 footers, which I won't go into.




                        You are being presumptuous if you are inferring that I dont think that there are sometimes reasons when someone should shoot at a 9 footer even if they are leaving a 3 footer.
                        I have an offensive situational strategy that goes well beyond what most people think offensive strategy should be. I just dont ever get much chance to present it. I always believe that you should first understand what is bad before you make a determination as to what is good.
                        As far as I am concerned It still hasnt yet been firmly established that there is any advantage to shooting a shots that have less distance to travel.

                        Beard



                        I am done here. Now it is time to stir my Sunday sauce made with Lamb bones. It makes a sauce richer than Donald Trump.

                        That's exactly what I was talking about. Enjoy your day.

                        Dr. Bill

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Am I to understand....

                          Originally posted by wincardona View Post
                          That's exactly what I was talking about. Enjoy your day.

                          Dr. Bill
                          ...That you are trying to say, bad is good? And more is less?

                          Beard

                          How could I possible argue against such solid rationale? No wonder the Ghost has a hit out on you.
                          New stuff on my site. 100s of pgs. of pool goodness
                          www.bankingwiththebeard.com

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