Orcollo/Chohan Match?????

[cincy_kid]

Well, 50% after expenses at best. But John is 100% correct about the Rack; the money was so large that after the player's shock of not getting half or even 40%, they were grateful to get in put the box at whatever their cut.

And sometimes the winner was not even determined yet!!!

Dave

At the same time of never being staked, I also have never staked anyone either. I will bet on someone on the side or w/e but never been a stake-horse (nor do want to be). But if I were to stake someone, if I was not giving them 50% I would wonder of there was any funny business going on. I realize people have their reputations and would not want that coming out about them but I am just saying if someone is getting 25% from me but his opponent says "lets just chop it up"..well now he gets 50% by losing...

stranger things have happened!

 

[12squared]

At the same time of never being staked, I also have never staked anyone either. I will bet on someone on the side or w/e but never been a stake-horse (nor do want to be). But if I were to stake someone, if I was not giving them 50% I would wonder of there was any funny business going on. I realize people have their reputations and would not want that coming out about them but I am just saying if someone is getting 25% from me but his opponent says "lets just chop it up"..well now he gets 50% by losing...

stranger things have happened!

yes, the perils of being a stake horse. It's not for everyone, you really have to trust your horse.

 

[one pocket guy]

Frost/Occullo

Frost/Occullo

You got me Kid if it comes off.
In D/T I can't bet against the little feller

 

[LSJohn]

Like I said, I have never been staked, never been offered to me, and I have never asked.

BUT, if someone did want to stake me, I would ask for half or not play, that's all I was saying...

Short-sightedly hard-headed, IMO. An opportunity to make some money with no risk, doing something you enjoy doing, then lay down a criterion that makes it a bad deal for the person offering you the opportunity.

I don't know what principle you are basing it upon. It's as though you would resent someone making a profit on your effort, no matter how good it was for you.

I love ya Kid, or I wouldn't speak so directly..... or maybe I would.

 

[cincy_kid]

Short-sightedly hard-headed, IMO. An opportunity to make some money with no risk, doing something you enjoy doing, then lay down a criterion that makes it a bad deal for the person offering you the opportunity.

I don't know what principle you are basing it upon. It's as though you would resent someone making a profit on your effort, no matter how good it was for you.

I love ya Kid, or I wouldn't speak so directly..... or maybe I would.

Absolutely not. Why should I care if someone is benefiting from my efforts? As long as I had a chance to get in on the action too, I would encourage it. Just makes me more confident in the game I am in.

I guess I am too nice of a guy. I feel if I am staking someone and they are doing all the heavy lifting and I get to sit back and sweat it, they deserve half which is what I would give them. So in return if I were being staked I would expect the same.

(I know it doesn't work that way currently. I am just stating how it would be if I were to choose to be involved on one side or the other)

and by the way, I love direct John, anything else would be uncivilized

 

[El Chapo]

So, if the bet was a million you wouldn't let someone stake you for less than half? I understand nobody is playing for a million but just trying to make a point; i.e. any player has got to get up for big money, even if the percentage is small. I am actually full fledged surprised at how large the percentage the player gets in these big matches to be honest.

 

[LSJohn]

Absolutely not. Why should I care if someone is benefiting from my efforts? As long as I had a chance to get in on the action too, I would encourage it. Just makes me more confident in the game I am in.

I guess I am too nice of a guy. I feel if I am staking someone and they are doing all the heavy lifting and I get to sit back and sweat it, they deserve half which is what I would give them. So in return if I were being staked I would expect the same.

(I know it doesn't work that way currently. I am just stating how it would be if I were to choose to be involved on one side or the other)

and by the way, I love direct John, anything else would be uncivilized

Well, it's real easy for me to move to "Agree to disagree" because I'm one of the few people who is always right when that happens.

 

[youngstown]

Orcollo/Chohan Match?????

I'd be interested to hear from ppl who have been staked, who have also had ppl side betting on them who didn't give any jelly, or very little.

 

[crabbcatjohn]

I've never heard of a player who got 50% being staked unless it was a one time, sure thing. If you backed a player on a regular basis giving them 50% the odds would make it near impossible for you to make money.

 

[youngstown]

Orcollo/Chohan Match?????

I've never heard of a player who got 50% being staked unless it was a one time, sure thing. If you backed a player on a regular basis giving them 50% the odds would make it near impossible for you to make money.

If you're even money to win, agreed. However, the thing is - sometimes stakehorses pride themselves on having a line on players, whether they do or not is another story, of course. This confidence allows/causes them to bet "against the odds"

I had a friends who liked to back me. Prob did it a dozen times. We would split. I'm pretty sure he is in the black, but we took a couple big losses that might make it disputable. Both times, I told him I didn't like the match up, but he didn't care. He had more gamble/heart than I did, I guess.

It's s not always just about probability and statistics, professor. Lmao.

 

[crabbcatjohn]

If you're even money to win, agreed. However, the thing is - sometimes stakehorses pride themselves on having a line on players, whether they do or not is another story, of course. This confidence allows/causes them to bet "against the odds"

I had a friends who liked to back me. Prob did it a dozen times. We would split. I'm pretty sure he is in the black, but we took a couple big losses that might make it disputable. Both times, I told him I didn't like the match up, but he didn't care. He had more gamble/heart than I did, I guess.

It's s not always just about probability and statistics, professor. Lmao.

I don't understand your point, I was talking about win loss percentages against player splits with a regular backer. I assumed we were talking about professional gambler/stakehorses.
If your making some kind of point by calling me "professor" and talking about "friends" backing you in a losing game and having"gamble" and splitting with you that's not what i was discussing.

 

[youngstown]

Orcollo/Chohan Match?????

I don't understand your point, I was talking about win loss percentages against player splits with a regular backer. I assumed we were talking about professional gambler/stakehorses.

If your making some kind of point by calling me "professor" and talking about "friends" backing you in a losing game and having"gamble" and splitting with you that's not what i was discussing.

Nevermind, was just trying to be funny, only point was that the backers don't always care about logic, or acknowledge proper statistics, but I get your point.

 

[cincy_kid]

So, if the bet was a million you wouldn't let someone stake you for less than half? I understand nobody is playing for a million but just trying to make a point; i.e. any player has got to get up for big money, even if the percentage is small. I am actually full fledged surprised at how large the percentage the player gets in these big matches to be honest.

Im sure I would gladly jump up and play for less (say $490,000?)

Just kidding...who knows, I have never been in that situation but I would venture to say I would take whatever I could get and I understand that's your point on this.

Like I said, I have zero experience being staked and zero experience in staking so I was just voicing my personal opinion of how I would feel if I were involved.

 

[crabbcatjohn]

Im sure I would gladly jump up and play for less (say $490,000?)

Just kidding...who knows, I have never been in that situation but I would venture to say I would take whatever I could get and I understand that's your point on this.

Like I said, I have zero experience being staked and zero experience in staking so I was just voicing my personal opinion of how I would feel if I were involved.

Consider this.. If a player doesn't pay for losses... If your backer put you out there in 5 different sessions over the course of say 6 months, gives you 50% on wins and bets 1k each session, how many of those 5 sessions would you have to win in order for your backer to win 1k. How much would your backer win if you won 3 and lost 2 in those sessions...

 

[cincy_kid]

Consider this.. If a player doesn't pay for losses... If your backer put you out there in 5 different sessions over the course of say 6 months, gives you 50% on wins and bets 1k each session, how many of those 5 sessions would you have to win in order for your backer to win 1k.

I think if I had an arrangement with a backer and they were going to stake me over a period of time in multiple match ups I can totally see coming up with a smaller %.

I guess I was thinking more of a one time thing.

 

[crabbcatjohn]

I think if I had an arrangement with a backer and they were going to stake me over a period of time in multiple match ups I can totally see coming up with a smaller %.

I guess I was thinking more of a one time thing.

If the player wins 3 and looses 2 out of 5 the backer looses money. Think about that next time you ship a player 50%

 

[cincy_kid]

If the player wins 3 and looses 2 out of 5 the backer looses money. Think about that next time you ship a player 50%

I get it John..but since I don't participate in backing or being backed I should be good to go!

You know, while we are on this subject, something I will add.

I have known a lot of people over the years who will gamble on anything. A flip of a coin, if its going to rain tomorrow, or you name it. Me, on the other hand, although I can get a rush from gambling, I really don't do it UNLESS I am betting on myself.

I have never enjoyed betting on horses or sports or someone else's performance other than a mailbox money sweat bet or w/e you want to call it. I have always felt like if I am betting on something it should be based on my own performance. That way, if I play good I get rewarded. If I play bad, I lose. It makes me better and makes me focus more.

I don't have to worry if someone is throwing the match, or taking a fall in the 6th round or was paid off to lose in the world series. I also like to be in control of my betting. When I am watching a sports team on TV, it doesn't matter how much I root for them, its not going to change the outcome, I am not in control.

So, personally, I have always kept my betting limited to betting on something I had some sort of control over during the process. Whether it was pool, ping pong or pinochle, I was in control of my own destiny. That's just the way I like it and probably the reason I don't stake or like being staked.

(on top of that, if I was being staked and lost, I would feel like complete crap)

 

[crabbcatjohn]

I get it John..but since I don't participate in backing or being backed I should be good to go!

You know, while we are on this subject, something I will add.

I have known a lot of people over the years who will gamble on anything. A flip of a coin, if its going to rain tomorrow, or you name it. Me, on the other hand, although I can get a rush from gambling, I really don't do it UNLESS I am betting on myself.

I have never enjoyed betting on horses or sports or someone else's performance other than a mailbox money sweat bet or w/e you want to call it. I have always felt like if I am betting on something it should be based on my own performance. That way, if I play good I get rewarded. If I play bad, I lose. It makes me better and makes me focus more.

I don't have to worry if someone is throwing the match, or taking a fall in the 6th round or was paid off to lose in the world series. I also like to be in control of my betting. When I am watching a sports team on TV, it doesn't matter how much I root for them, its not going to change the outcome, I am not in control.

So, personally, I have always kept my betting limited to betting on something I had some sort of control over during the process. Whether it was pool, ping pong or pinochle, I was in control of my own destiny. That's just the way I like it and probably the reason I don't stake or like being staked.

(on top of that, if I was being staked and lost, I would feel like complete crap)

I always bet my own and i've seen many times where there is more money than i bet for or against me on the side...lol

 

[LSJohn]

I think if I had an arrangement with a backer and they were going to stake me over a period of time in multiple match ups I can totally see coming up with a smaller %.

I guess I was thinking more of a one time thing.

50% is fine in one set of circumstances: If two guys take a road trip, or gamble often at home as partners, and split the net profit after expenses on the road or once a month at home, that's fair. One-time deal, or now-and-then, splitting 50/50 on each event, no way.

You'd be screwing your backer by taking advantage of the fact that he wanted to gamble so badly he'd take a terrible deal if you talked him into 50% on a one-time deal.

 

[crabbcatjohn]

50% is fine in one set of circumstances: If two guys take a road trip, or gamble often at home as partners, and split the net profit after expenses on the road or once a month at home, that's fair. One-time deal, or now-and-then, splitting 50/50 on each event, no way.

You'd be screwing your backer by taking advantage of the fact that he wanted to gamble so badly he'd take a terrible deal if you talked him into 50% on a one-time deal.

Whats the normal Jelly these days on auctions out there in the world LSJohn ?