Kicking

vapros

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baton rouge, la
I am near the foot rail, near my pocket. There is a combination in the stack I want to hit, kicking off the far long rail. Standing, I can see the kick, but I go over to the other side and look again and it looks a bit different. I shoot the kick and don't quite get it right.

How do you folks do it? Which view works for you? Do you look at it both ways? Do they look alike? Are you confident shooting such kicks? Thanks -
 

Billy Jackets

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I am near the foot rail, near my pocket. There is a combination in the stack I want to hit, kicking off the far long rail. Standing, I can see the kick, but I go over to the other side and look again and it looks a bit different. I shoot the kick and don't quite get it right.

How do you folks do it? Which view works for you? Do you look at it both ways? Do they look alike? Are you confident shooting such kicks? Thanks -

I practice kicking from a diamond on my side , through a point on their long rail that takes me along the path I need the cueball to go to hit the ball in the required spot.
Remember, you are coming toward the ball from below or above, at an angle, so you might have to adjust for throw !
I also try to find a spot on the wall, to aim at if I can, to dial it in even tighter.
You should be able to kick from diamond 1 on your side through diamond 2 on their side and the center of the cueball be really close to going through diamond three on your side . If you are not that accurate , you need more practice.
You also need to be able to do it at about 3 different speeds.
The harder you shoot, the shorter it goes.
You probably know all this , but maybe someone else doesn't., and it will help them.
 

beatle

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it really is a diamond shot. use parallel aiming from a diamond and move over to the exact spot you want to hit on the object ball.

its a mathematical shot but very basic and letting how you see it only will change your correct point of impact.

if playing on a table you know, it should never be missed. on any other table you need to do all these type of rail shots at different speeds and english before you even play serious pool. unless of course you are totally robbing the guy.
 

gulfportdoc

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Coincidentally, Dr. Dave just posted this PDF handout for "Kickshot Mirror Aiming" on Facebook.

Here's the first page as a sample...

pj
chgo
I can see why he puts the "projected CB position" at the same distance from the side rail as is the OB. But how does he determine the initial line through the CB to the rail? How is he gauging where to point the cue stick? Is it just a guesstimate?

~Doc
 

Billy Jackets

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I can see why he puts the "projected CB position" at the same distance from the side rail as is the OB. But how does he determine the initial line through the CB to the rail? How is he gauging where to point the cue stick? Is it just a guesstimate?

~Doc

The equal distances line from L to R
 

Dennis "Whitey" Young

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I can see why he puts the "projected CB position" at the same distance from the side rail as is the OB. But how does he determine the initial line through the CB to the rail? How is he gauging where to point the cue stick? Is it just a guesstimate?

~Doc
Doc, exactly! How does the initial cb path get determined? I could not pull up the pdf., so if there is a further explaination then there might lie the answer.

But when taking to the table Scott Alex 3 Continued thread concerning how to play the 5 ball that was in front of a corner, I had a known spot to contact the rail, which gave me the correct cb path, and from this known, I tried this method and it did not work!

One would think this kick shot aiming formula would contact the ob squarely, in my test it severely overcut the 5 ball, not close!
With, highest respects towards Dr. Dave! I think he should be in a HOF somewhere! Whitey
 

gulfportdoc

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Doc, exactly! How does the initial cb path get determined? I could not pull up the pdf., so if there is a further explaination then there might lie the answer.

...
With, highest respects towards Dr. Dave! I think he should be in a HOF somewhere! Whitey
Right, to me it's not clear where one lays the stick down to indicate the CB side of the triangle (in the above picture). I watched the vid, but missed it if he explained it.

PJ, straighten us out, here!

~Doc
 

catkins

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isnt the line figured out by taking the point your aiming at and the point where the cue ball is and bisecting distance to determine the center line
 

gulfportdoc

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isnt the line figured out by taking the point your aiming at and the point where the cue ball is and bisecting distance to determine the center line
Yes, that's true. But my question is how one initially determines the point to aim at? It must be the mirror image point.

~Doc
 

Dennis "Whitey" Young

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Yes, that's true. But my question is how one initially determines the point to aim at? It must be the mirror image point.

~Doc
Doc, I went on line to Billiards; Mirror Image Aiming Method, and there are a few videos by Dr. Dave. In this case that PJ posted, the method used is to measure from the center of the ob to the diamond line and double it. From that point to the cue ball is the aiming line. The extra ghost ball as diagramed is of no real consequence and only adds another dimension of sorts, I guess for double checking by another method once the aiming line is established.
When the ob ball is closer to the rail another measuring method is used. And when not wanting to hit the ob square, yet another method is used.

I questioned the legality of using devices to measure or to check angles, and thus checked, and it is allowed in CSI/BCAPL when either banking a ball or kicking, but not allowed to be used to measure gaps for ball clearance to pass a ball through. So in DCC using the cue or hand to measure bank and kick shots is legal. It is illegal to place a chalk or otherwise mark the aiming point, and the foul is automatic, no shot needs to be taken! In WPA; marking the table is unsportsmanlike conduct.

I am not exactly that comfortable with a player using their stick or hand to measure, I am ok with using it to site in a bank or a shot. I do know that WPA does not allow the stick to be laid upon the table without your hand on it to site a shot.
But I can not find any info. from WPA concerning measuring shots, so it is legal to do so. Whitey
 
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lll

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vero beach fl
whitey
i have seen shane in tournament play use his stick to "double the distance" mirror system aim a kick
i know of no rule that makes it illegal
 

Patrick Johnson

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I can see why he puts the "projected CB position" at the same distance from the side rail as is the OB. But how does he determine the initial line through the CB to the rail? How is he gauging where to point the cue stick? Is it just a guesstimate?

~Doc
Kind of an edumacated guesstimate...

One way is to hold your cue so it passes over the CB and pivot it (at the CB) until it points to the rail contact point that appears to be halfway between the OB and the "ghost" CB.

More automatic: measure the OB's off-table mirror image (using your stick) and sight from there back through the rail toward the CB to find the rail contact point - same result; no estimating.

pj
chgo
 

Patrick Johnson

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Doc, I went on line to Billiards; Mirror Image Aiming Method, and there are a few videos by Dr. Dave. In this case that PJ posted, the method used is to measure from the center of the ob to the diamond line and double it.
I don't follow this - can you expand a little? How do you find the "center of the diamond line"?

pj
chgo
 

vapros

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Doc, I think the cue stick will always be pointed at the object ball and perpendicular to the table and is only used to find the 'spot on the wall.' A line from the 'spot' back to the cue ball crosses the cushion at the contact point. That's my understanding, anyway.
 
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