Serious rule opinions saught

petie

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At the pool hall the other day I was telling a guy who was new to One Pocket that in OP only, not in other games, when shooting from the kitchen, an object ball had to be all the way over the line in order to shoot at it. That is, in all other games you use "base of ball" over the line but in OP you use "back of ball" over the line. This is the way I was taught and have played it for many years without a challenge but the other day a new-to-OP straight pool player said it should be "base of ball."

The room owner who is also a straight pool player agreed with him saying that the only place where they played "back of ball" was at DCC.

I believe "back of ball" is a far better way to go because it would eliminate a lot of arguments. It is much easier to see on a close call especially when the stakes are high as they often are in OP.

What say you?
 

Cary

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If you're looking for a written rule, the WPA General Rules state:

8.13 Position of Balls
The position of a ball is determined by the projection of its center vertically downward onto the playing surface. A ball is said to be placed on a line or spot when its center is placed directly over that line or spot.

If you're looking for an opinion, I can argue back of ball just as well as center of ball. Any one who'd argue one will argue the other.
 

WhatWouldWojoDo

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Base or back of ball

Base or back of ball

I understand the discrepancy. Base of the ball can be hard to tell when it is close. But back of the ball is really easy to tell if it is on the head string or clear of it.

Just for the sake of arguments I would think they change the rule to the ball has to be completely outside of the kitchen.
 

petie

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Who cares ? :confused: Agree before you start.
Rod.[/QUOTE

I would just like to preserve the integrity of the game. Face it, base of ball was probably developed for straight pool. And are you saying that base of ball also applies to the cue ball? Couldn't that be sticky? Am I the only one that was taught back of ball for One Pocket? Would you like to be playing base of ball for $10,000?
 

androd

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Petie said:
I would just like to preserve the integrity of the game. Face it, base of ball was probably developed for straight pool. And are you saying that base of ball also applies to the cue ball? Couldn't that be sticky? Am I the only one that was taught back of ball for One Pocket? Would you like to be playing base of ball for $10,000?

Only playing you. :p:p:p
Rod.
 

tucson9ball

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I know they used to play "whole ball" years ago, but I think the rule changed in the 80's to "base of ball".

I'm no expert on rules, maybe somebody can quote the rule book for this one?
 

beatle

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thats what happens when players try to put tournament rules into the pool room. you dont play by strict tournament rules when you play golf with people. if you did you would end up playing alone.
 

TheTravlin'Yankee

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Always played whole ball behind head string for reason(s) mentioned. Its easier to see than the center of the ball. This being said, one better let the other player know he is ahead of the line before he takes his shot or there will be an argument. I agree setting the rules before the game is best, but the guys I play here in Milwaukee take it for granted that "in the kitchen" means "all the way in the kitchen" fir One Pocket.
 

Cary

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Wouldn't life be simpler for everyone to simply learn and agree to play by the One-Pocket.org rules? Which include WPA rules, for anything not specifically covered in our one pocket rules.

I'm pretty sure Steve asked for suggested rule changes a while back and got only a small amount of interest. I don't really care one way or the other (I'm in the geezer category that started playing when it was the whole ball for ALL games) but to cut down on arguments and hour long negotiations I'd sure like to have a standardized set of rules.

FWIW, by my nature I'm really reluctant to agree to any deviation from written standardized rules that might be suggested by a potential opponent. Usually there's a reason it's important to them.
 

tylerdurden

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Who cares ? :confused: Agree before you start.
Rod.

I think we should care, because it would obviously be nice to have one, universal agreed upon rule, without all the ambiguity. Wouldn't it? :confused:

I agree with the op btw in that it is easier to judge if it is the "back of the ball." For me, this is reason enough for us to solidy make that the rule. There really is no drawback to just making the rule "entire ball must be over". There are only positives.
 

petie

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Wouldn't life be simpler for everyone to simply learn and agree to play by the One-Pocket.org rules? Which include WPA rules, for anything not specifically covered in our one pocket rules.

I'm pretty sure Steve asked for suggested rule changes a while back and got only a small amount of interest. I don't really care one way or the other (I'm in the geezer category that started playing when it was the whole ball for ALL games) but to cut down on arguments and hour long negotiations I'd sure like to have a standardized set of rules.

FWIW, by my nature I'm really reluctant to agree to any deviation from written standardized rules that might be suggested by a potential opponent. Usually there's a reason it's important to them.

I haven't read the complete rules on our website--only ones that pertain to certain question or other that come up. I would like to suggest an addition of this "back of ball" rule. Otherwise, we will have every league player in the country changing what has been the way we play for years.
 

NH Steve

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Serious rule opinions saught

The room owner nailed it. Far as I know Derby city is the only major tournament that goes by the whole ball not the base of the ball

House rules can be a different story altogether of course
 

androd

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I say, How we playing, they say OB's touching it's in. I say CB touching it's out.
They say HUH ?
Rod.
P.S. Again I say who cares ? no difference.
 

SactownTom

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Sacramento CA
40 some years being a rules nut and I still hear this argument.

Base of the Ball in tournaments, what the players agree to when matching up.

One 'old timer', I mean the guy was in his 80s asked me,
"what if it is on the line?"
The rule says 'behind the line' not on it. What's the rule?

Base or edge of the ball still has to be OVER the line to be considered a legal ball to pocket.

At my age, even with corrective lens, I cannot even see the line. :mad:
 

tylerdurden

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"In golf, going in the water is a 2 stroke penalty, but when we play ourselves, it is whatever we want it to be".

That is true no doubt, but would it not be simpler just to play 2 stroke penalty consistently? The answer is yes, but that does not matter.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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I say, How we playing, they say OB's touching it's in. I say CB touching it's out.
They say HUH ?It must be nice playing morons:p.
Rod.
P.S. Again I say who cares ? no difference.

Rod,

Just between me & you, since this is one of the dumbest threads I've ever seen here, I'll tell you a little story about a tournament I played in where "base of the ball" came up. It was a 9-Ball tourney and it was "base of the ball" rules. My opponent scratched on the break (1 foul BIH). At that time it was still played BIH behind the line for a scratch on the break.

In my opinion the 1 ball was just over the headstring so I put the cueball down to shoot it. I had an easy runout if I could shoot the 1 ball. The 2 ball was almost froze to the center of the footrail though so I needed the 1 ball to get to it.

When my oppo saw me getting ready to shoot the 1 he said it was behind the line because the base was touching the headstring. We argued for a minute and the TD came over. I asked him if the base of the ball was directly below the center of the ball. He said it was. I told him the center of the ball was clearly over the line(which it was) and he agreed as did everybody who looked at it. I told him the ball was over the line because the center was over the line:). I almost got away with it but they were all too smart for me. They said the base was touching the line and that's the rule they were using, not "center of the ball".

I took a shot:D

Anyone who wants to play "base of the ball" just wants to argue later on.

Dennis
 

petie

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Citrus Springs, FL
Rod,

Just between me & you, since this is one of the dumbest threads I've ever seen here, I'll tell you a little story about a tournament I played in where "base of the ball" came up. It was a 9-Ball tourney and it was "base of the ball" rules. My opponent scratched on the break (1 foul BIH). At that time it was still played BIH behind the line for a scratch on the break.

In my opinion the 1 ball was just over the headstring so I put the cueball down to shoot it. I had an easy runout if I could shoot the 1 ball. The 2 ball was almost froze to the center of the footrail though so I needed the 1 ball to get to it.

When my oppo saw me getting ready to shoot the 1 he said it was behind the line because the base was touching the headstring. We argued for a minute and the TD came over. I asked him if the base of the ball was directly below the center of the ball. He said it was. I told him the center of the ball was clearly over the line(which it was) and he agreed as did everybody who looked at it. I told him the ball was over the line because the center was over the line:). I almost got away with it but they were all too smart for me. They said the base was touching the line and that's the rule they were using, not "center of the ball".

I took a shot:D

Anyone who wants to play "base of the ball" just wants to argue later on.

Dennis

This is my point, Dennis.
 

Cary

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Bertram, Texas
Rod,

Just between me & you, since this is one of the dumbest threads I've ever seen here, I'll tell you a little story about a tournament I played in where "base of the ball" came up. It was a 9-Ball tourney and it was "base of the ball" rules. My opponent scratched on the break (1 foul BIH). At that time it was still played BIH behind the line for a scratch on the break.

In my opinion the 1 ball was just over the headstring so I put the cueball down to shoot it. I had an easy runout if I could shoot the 1 ball. The 2 ball was almost froze to the center of the footrail though so I needed the 1 ball to get to it.

When my oppo saw me getting ready to shoot the 1 he said it was behind the line because the base was touching the headstring. We argued for a minute and the TD came over. I asked him if the base of the ball was directly below the center of the ball. He said it was. I told him the center of the ball was clearly over the line(which it was) and he agreed as did everybody who looked at it. I told him the ball was over the line because the center was over the line:). I almost got away with it but they were all too smart for me. They said the base was touching the line and that's the rule they were using, not "center of the ball".

I took a shot:D

Anyone who wants to play "base of the ball" just wants to argue later on.

Dennis

How wide was the line?
 
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