JUST IN!! New evidence surfaces in Da Beard teaching Efren onepocket!!

SJDinPHX

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fred bentivegna said:
SJDinPHX said:
...Do you honestly think I care who showed Efren the basics of one pocket. I know he spent some time in Chicago, early on...As solid a player as he was, (and intelligent) don't you think he learned 95% of his game from his competition, over the years ?...

No amount of smiley faces, or "wuv you's" can cover up the amount of bile that must have been gurgling in his throat when he posted that.

Beard


The only time bile forms in my mouth, is when your gigantically insecure ego, finds it necessary to scream IN BIG BOLD RED LETTERS

every time your Sensitive, Epidermally Challenged ass gets questioned, about ANYTHING pool related!!!...Regardless of how insignificant, or cruel the affront happens to be, or who authored it !!!.:confused: :confused: :confused:

Anatidae Boy <---Still 'wuvs' you though...;)
 
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fred bentivegna

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Bump for a bilious Dick

Bump for a bilious Dick

fred bentivegna said:
SJDinPHX said:
...Do you honestly think I care who showed Efren the basics of one pocket. I know he spent some time in Chicago, early on...As solid a player as he was, (and intelligent) don't you think he learned 95% of his game from his competition, over the years ?...


That line was so petty, so bitter, and so jealously resentful, that I think it requires a well deserved bump in order to insure its place in the "Cheapest, Creepiest Shots Ever Taken on the Forum."
No amount of smiley faces, or "wuv you's" can cover up the amount of bile that must have been gurgling in his throat when he posted that.

Beard

I am still waiting for some of our more "honest/fair-minded" posters to get a set of balls and call this jerk out for posting that bag of sour, rotten grapes and then doing his usual, blaming the victim. Notice the bile gurgler has never once mentioned the video and unsolicited sound bite of Efren's declaration.
He has also tactfully avoided all mention of Darren Appleton's success off of The Dick's one pocket lessons. I know of other students that would also like a refund.

If you removed epidermally challenged and thin-skinned from his vocabulary, he couldnt say much past, "hello."

Beard
 

SJDinPHX

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fred bentivegna said:
fred bentivegna said:
I am still waiting for some of our more "honest/fair-minded" posters to get a set of balls and call this jerk out for posting that bag of sour, rotten grapes and then doing his usual, blaming the victim. Notice the bile gurgler has never once mentioned the video and unsolicited sound bite of Efren's declaration.
He has also tactfully avoided all mention of Darren Appleton's success off of The Dick's one pocket lessons. I know of other students that would also like a refund.

If you removed epidermally challenged and thin-skinned from his vocabulary, he couldnt say much past, "hello."

Beard

Just lost a half page response to your latest rant..In which I answered both your burning questions. If you can handle the truth, I may try again later

Your plea for an honest poster (with balls) was very touching...Careful, you may get it...Its a shame you haven't noticed, even your local support group has fallen silent, at your latest mental lapse...:rolleyes:

PS..Are you still under the delusion, that anyone gives a "big rats ass" about your excessive ranting and "bumping"...It only shows an extreme lack of creativity...(probably why you never excelled at one pocket)....:eek:
 
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Cowboy Dennis

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fred bentivegna said:
fred bentivegna said:
I am still waiting for some of our more "honest/fair-minded" posters to get a set of balls and call this jerk out for posting that bag of sour, rotten grapes and then doing his usual, blaming the victim. Notice the bile gurgler has never once mentioned the video and unsolicited sound bite of Efren's declaration.
He has also tactfully avoided all mention of Darren Appleton's success off of The Dick's one pocket lessons. I know of other students that would also like a refund.


Beard

Freddy,

You once told me and I quote "Dennis, I say this without reservation, you are the most fair, sensible, neutral, honest, sumbitch on the forums".

I know that you don't think that anymore so that's why I haven't injected my opinions into this mostly comical spat between you and the Duck. If you could take it humorously and not get pissed even more than you are at me now, I would point out several things to both SJD & you. I would also do it fairly, honestly, sensibly, and neutrally as is my habit.

As you know from my posts the last couple of years, I write what I think & feel and I don't give a damn who doesn't like it. I have things to write that SJD won't agree with and I have things to write that you won't agree with. The thing is this, you perceive it as a personal attack if I disagree with you and I'd just as soon not get your blood pressure up un-neccessarily. I know for a fact that the Duck doesn't get upset at anything I write as he & I have had many serious disagreements over the last couple of years, mostly over stupid political shit that we now forbid from our conversations, but we have never once had a cross word to say (or write) to each other, even in the heat of battle and over many drinks:p .

Bottom line is this Freddy: I'll comment on this thread (and the entire Freddy taught Efren thing) if you want me to but it's up to you.

P.S. I have not and probably will not listen to the audio in the link that Greg posted.

P.PS. I have not talked to SJD about this thread or subject so don't be feeling paranoid like we are setting you up. Nobody influences my thoughts or words and you should know that by now.

Dennis
 

fred bentivegna

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Have at it.

Have at it.

Cowboy Dennis said:
fred bentivegna said:
Freddy,

You once told me and I quote "Dennis, I say this without reservation, you are the most fair, sensible, neutral, honest, sumbitch on the forums".

I know that you don't think that anymore so that's why I haven't injected my opinions into this mostly comical spat between you and the Duck. If you could take it humorously and not get pissed even more than you are at me now, I would point out several things to both SJD & you. I would also do it fairly, honestly, sensibly, and neutrally as is my habit.

As you know from my posts the last couple of years, I write what I think & feel and I don't give a damn who doesn't like it. I have things to write that SJD won't agree with and I have things to write that you won't agree with. The thing is this, you perceive it as a personal attack if I disagree with you and I'd just as soon not get your blood pressure up un-neccessarily. I know for a fact that the Duck doesn't get upset at anything I write as he & I have had many serious disagreements over the last couple of years, mostly over stupid political shit that we now forbid from our conversations, but we have never once had a cross word to say (or write) to each other, even in the heat of battle and over many drinks:p .

Bottom line is this Freddy: I'll comment on this thread (and the entire Freddy taught Efren thing) if you want me to but it's up to you.

P.S. I have not and probably will not listen to the audio in the link that Greg posted.

P.PS. I have not talked to SJD about this thread or subject so don't be feeling paranoid like we are setting you up. Nobody influences my thoughts or words and you should know that by now.

Dennis


You're right. I did make that comment once. And did think like that. But maybe like all of us, we are not so objective when it comes to matters that affect us personally. Say what you will. Thats why this is a forum. Everybody else is apparently terrified of upsetting the Bile Gurgler.

Beard
 

Cowboy Dennis

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fred bentivegna said:
Cowboy Dennis said:
You're right. I did make that comment once. And did think like that. But maybe like all of us, we are not so objective when it comes to matters that affect us personally. Say what you will. Thats why this is a forum. Everybody else is apparently terrified of upsetting the Bile Gurgler.

Beard
O.K. Freddy, I'll be working on it and it won't be personal to you or the Duck either. Strictly business.

Dennis
 

petie

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This reminds me of an adolescent pissing contest. Having spent a lifetime in sales, I have never had the luxury of saying that last, "I told you so." or "Nah, nah, na nah, nah." I would have starved to death had I done it because it loses sales and is known to be juvenile. In sales you can get into what is known in the profession as a, "Ya but" conversation. You refute each of the prospective customer's negative points or objections and win the logical battle but you lose the sale because you are saying, "ya but this or that" which is obnoxious. At some point, the mature person, the one with the longer vision, just bites his tongue and lets the other person have the last word.

I thought Dick's post to the Passing of Freddy's best friend was sweet and sounds a lot more like where he is really coming from than the attempts at humor at Freddy's expense to which Freddy is so overly sensitive. Face it. He pushes your buttons because he knows he can rely on you for a knee-jerk reaction.

I wouldn't presume to arbitrate you guys' relationship but do you ever talk off the forum? A little heart to heart once in awhile can work wonders. You both seem like you have big hearts and sentimental feelings. That's quite a lot to start with.

Just my opinion. Pete
 
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CaliRed

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Cowboy Dennis said:
P.S. I have not and probably will not listen to the audio in the link that Greg posted.

Dennis

Just to be clear, my audio link is simply Steve Booth's very short interview with Efren after he won the onepocket championship last week. The only thing I did was slow down one sentence that Efren said so it was easier to understand.

I thought by posting it, while having some fun concocting this blatantly over the top story about I was some sort of detective unearthing some earth shattering new evidence, that it would lay to rest at least one thing Dick and Freddy had to argue about. Maybe even possibly getting them to both laugh about it in the process.

Boy was I wrong. :) I won't try that approach again.
 

Artie Bodendorfer

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wincardona said:
Cowboy Dennis said:
Wait!!! But first you must find Dr Watson.:D

Dr. Bill


Freddy you should be gitting a end from Eferine for all the one pocket tournements he won.

See if the doctor can get you a end?

Thier pretty close you no that.

I think you are intitled too at least concederation. I no if you would have taught Billy Incardone howe too play one pocket.

You would be getting a check every time he won.

Im lucky you didnt give him any lessions. Because he would have won.

Or did you show him howe too play one pocket. On the sneekat the golden eight ball.

Because I no you would have loved that. And you would have got me.

Im glade you didnt think about it. Is it too late in life too showe Billy howe to play and the moves???

Freddy Billy is a good coustomer. And you no he is a very good listner.

Its never too late too learn. And dont give up none off the secrets.

Even though he is a good ege.

But before the lessions Give him the best back doctor. Because without him being in shape.

It will be too hard for him too play.

And our bones are a little brittle now.

But if you have a great back doctor go ahead and give him the doctors name.

And not Kavorcian. WE still need himaround for 30 years.

Thier areant too meny off us left from the Hippie days and beatnicks.

Howe do you think Abraham Lincon would feell today. Was he the best president??????

Freddy give Billy some off the Goasts mental toughness. Billy is mentaly tough. But not phisical.

Billy always looks good. He never ages. And he keeps improving with his talking.

Who was a better looking guy in thier prime. Billy oe Scott?

THis is a major qouistion.

Think before answereing.
 

fred bentivegna

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Evidence? What evidence?

Evidence? What evidence?

CaliRed said:
Just to be clear, my audio link is simply Steve Booth's very short interview with Efren after he won the onepocket championship last week. The only thing I did was slow down one sentence that Efren said so it was easier to understand.

I thought by posting it, while having some fun concocting this blatantly over the top story about I was some sort of detective unearthing some earth shattering new evidence, that it would lay to rest at least one thing Dick and Freddy had to argue about. Maybe even possibly getting them to both laugh about it in the process.

Boy was I wrong. :) I won't try that approach again.


We are still waiting for Bile Breath to even acknowledge the sound bite as emanating here on earth. In all the reply posts on this thread he hasnt made the tiniest reference to the sound bite. He is still talking about the napkin that he wipes the pablum drool off of his chin.

He is like the guy with fingers in both ears mouthing, "I can't hear you!"

Beard
 

Cowboy Dennis

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fred bentivegna said:
We are still waiting for Bile Breath to even acknowledge the sound bite as emanating here on earth. In all the reply posts on this thread he hasnt made the tiniest reference to the sound bite. He is still talking about the napkin that he wipes the pablum drool off of his chin.

He is like the guy with fingers in both ears mouthing, "I can't hear you!"

Beard
Freddie,

I changed my mind and decided to listen to the audio clip that Greg posted. I thought it only fair to see & hear all "evidence" before writing my post.

Dennis
 

androd

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fred bentivegna said:
He is like the guy with fingers in both ears mouthing, "I can't hear you!"

Beard

I take a fish to that.:D :p Don't bring me into just because I'm hard of hearing.
Rod.-------< Getting in touch with my paranoid side.;)
 

Cowboy Dennis

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CaliRed said:
Just to be clear, my audio link is simply Steve Booth's very short interview with Efren after he won the onepocket championship last week. The only thing I did was slow down one sentence that Efren said so it was easier to understand.

I thought by posting it, while having some fun concocting this blatantly over the top story about I was some sort of detective unearthing some earth shattering new evidence, that it would lay to rest at least one thing Dick and Freddy had to argue about. Maybe even possibly getting them to both laugh about it in the process.

Boy was I wrong. :) I won't try that approach again.
Actually Greg, it was very funny and to hell with anyone who can't see that. I did end up listening to the audio link you provided also.


Dennis
 

Cowboy Dennis

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Fred bentivegna said:
Cowboy Dennis said:
You're right. I did make that comment once. And did think like that. But maybe like all of us, we are not so objective when it comes to matters that affect us personally. Say what you will. That's why this is a forum. Everybody else is apparently terrified of upsetting the Bile Gurgler.

Beard
Freddie,

Here's my feeble attempt at understanding, I just don't have the time to search all posts and quote lines and names but I have done some searching.

First off, you must know that whatever I write the Duck is going to respond in his well-known style to anything he can make fun of. That said, I'll tell what I think, not that it means much. I'll also say that I listened to the audio clip that Greg posted, I figured I may as well since it was there.

When I saw this line from SJD I thought for sure he had made a mistake that you would jump all over. If he had written some weak shit like this to me I would have been very happy. It's well known that you played Efren during his very important formative first year of learning one-pocket. I've seen several different posts on the topic but most say that you and Efren played 4-5 times a week for about a year or so. This is when Efren's foundation for the game was laid. The things we learn in the first year from a knowledgeable player stay with us forever. As far as I'm concerned SJD partially confirmed what you've been saying all along. Efren was a genius and a great player but he was able to build on the foundation that you helped lay. He may have picked up the game anyway but learning it correctly from you and Billy I. in Chicago probably accelerated his learning curve. That cannot be argued by the Duck or anyone else. Efren never had to un-learn anything because he learned from guys who knew how to play the game.
SJD inPHX said:
Do you honestly think I care who showed Efren the basics of one pocket. I know he spent some time in Chicago, early on...As solid a player as he was, (and intelligent) don't you think he learned 95% of his game from his competition, over the years ?

These posts from Phil Welch say a lot about you & Efren playing.
philwelch said:
I can attest to Freddy's claim of teaching Efren onepocket. I was working the counter at the Chgo Billiard Cafe at that time and I guarantee that Efren's first real bout with one pocket was with Fred. As Fred said they played for weeks and Efren learned a lot in that period of time. I know people want to laugh at the thought that Freddy was teaching the perhaps the greatest one pocket player of all time, but that was definately the case. Of course Efren isn't ashamed of giving Freddy his due props, 'cause that's just the way Efren rolls.

Phil Welch (I witnessed it with my own eyes).
philwelch said:
Wow!!! Am I a pool fan? I guess I am I spent a good thirty years playing pool and back in the eighties spent most every day at the Billiard Cafe. I'm only speaking of what which I know. Efren spent a great deal of time at the Cafe.
I got to see him play Freddy on a daily basis and at that time Efren knew one pocket like I know quantum physics!
Efren played Billy Incardona too after he spent weeks playing Freddy. I also got to see him play Bugs. That was the best era of my pool experience. The Cafe had action galore due in many respects to Freddy whom had his own table and held court daily. I don't know who Old School is but if he knows me please reveal yourself. I have nothing to gain by my claims. I'm only speaking the truth about what happened back then. I do have brown eyes so I might be full of s__t!

Phil Welch has integrity and honesty from every post that I ever remember him making and his words mean a lot to me.


As you have since cleared up for us, you were gambling with Efren not "teaching" per se. That brings me to the "Executive West" thank you note. Since I don't remember how it came to be I would have to guess that it was solicited by you from Efren. If that's the case then it means almost nothing since a solicited "thank you" does not equal one freely given.

The audio that Greg posted is better since Efren made an unsolicited statement thanking you for having taught him how to play one-pocket. It may have been prodded in part by Steve mentioning Chicago-style one-pocket but Efren still made the statement unsolicited, therefore it carries weight. I think I understand from the audio clip that it was a hard-fought, one-ball-at-a-time game so it's understandable that the Chicago-style was mentioned by Steve. When Chicago is mentioned and Efren immediately thinks of you, that's very complimentary.

That Efren still thanks you after 25 years for being the guy he learned from means a lot and I would be justifiably proud if I had helped someone of his caliber, both as a man and as a player, become better at the game we love.

Anyway Freddie, I don't think I've revealed anything new here or anything special. You helped lay the foundation for Efren's one-pocket game and he built on that and became the greatest player ever. You will always be connected to him through that experience and like I said, I would be proud of that myself.

Dennis
 

SJDinPHX

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Cowboy Dennis said:
Fred bentivegna said:
Freddie,

First off, you must know that whatever I write the Duck is going to respond in his well-known style to anything he can make fun of.

When I saw this line from SJD I thought for sure he had made a mistake that you would jump all over. If he had written some weak shit like this to me I would have been very happy.

Dennis

Dear Rust Belt Lunatic,...and Former Duck Fan Club President... (Note; Now taking applications, for this high paying, prestigeous position.)

I always write 'weak shit" to you...Because I have to of drop down to your IQ level....I have grown tired of seeing everything I write, sail right over your "pea brain" head....
...So I am putting you back on "ignore"...:rolleyes:

PS..Before I do though, have you sent the $15K for RA and I's road trip yet ???.
 
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NH Steve

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Cowboy Dennis said:
Fred bentivegna said:
Freddie,

Here's my feeble attempt at understanding, I just don't have the time to search all posts and quote lines and names but I have done some searching.

First off, you must know that whatever I write the Duck is going to respond in his well-known style to anything he can make fun of. That said, I'll tell what I think, not that it means much. I'll also say that I listened to the audio clip that Greg posted, I figured I may as well since it was there.

When I saw this line from SJD I thought for sure he had made a mistake that you would jump all over. If he had written some weak shit like this to me I would have been very happy. It's well known that you played Efren during his very important formative first year of learning one-pocket. I've seen several different posts on the topic but most say that you and Efren played 4-5 times a week for about a year or so. This is when Efren's foundation for the game was laid. The things we learn in the first year from a knowledgeable player stay with us forever. As far as I'm concerned SJD partially confirmed what you've been saying all along. Efren was a genius and a great player but he was able to build on the foundation that you helped lay. He may have picked up the game anyway but learning it correctly from you and Billy I. in Chicago probably accelerated his learning curve. That cannot be argued by the Duck or anyone else. Efren never had to un-learn anything because he learned from guys who knew how to play the game.


These posts from Phil Welch say a lot about you & Efren playing.



Phil Welch has integrity and honesty from every post that I ever remember him making and his words mean a lot to me.


As you have since cleared up for us, you were gambling with Efren not "teaching" per se. That brings me to the "Executive West" thank you note. Since I don't remember how it came to be I would have to guess that it was solicited by you from Efren. If that's the case then it means almost nothing since a solicited "thank you" does not equal one freely given.

The audio that Greg posted is better since Efren made an unsolicited statement thanking you for having taught him how to play one-pocket. It may have been prodded in part by Steve mentioning Chicago-style one-pocket but Efren still made the statement unsolicited, therefore it carries weight. I think I understand from the audio clip that it was a hard-fought, one-ball-at-a-time game so it's understandable that the Chicago-style was mentioned by Steve. When Chicago is mentioned and Efren immediately thinks of you, that's very complimentary.

That Efren still thanks you after 25 years for being the guy he learned from means a lot and I would be justifiably proud if I had helped someone of his caliber, both as a man and as a player, become better at the game we love.

Anyway Freddie, I don't think I've revealed anything new here or anything special. You helped lay the foundation for Efren's one-pocket game and he built on that and became the greatest player ever. You will always be connected to him through that experience and like I said, I would be proud of that myself.

Dennis
Thank you -- this seems like a very good description to me. And I can assure you, when I fell into that interview with Efren after his victory in Vegas, the Chicago comment and Efren's response was totally unrehearsed nor was it intended to steer to Freddy. It came up just as you described it -- I watched the game, I knew Gentile was from Chicago and I had just witnessed (and Efren had just described) what many of us characterize as the "Chicago style", so it just flowed out of that. I also did not press it after it came up. They only gave me a couple of minutes anyway.
 
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