question for billy I

Artie Bodendorfer

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iusedtoberich said:
I'm going to take the opposite stance and say that Dippy's one free scratch per game is worth almost nothing, maybe a 1/4 ball at best.


I'm a weak player (C+/B-) and I've played the free scratch game a couple times. When I played it, I had a free scratch every time I had a shot, for the entire game. I played this against a much stronger opponent, who normally gave me 12-7 or so.

The scratches didn't help me. They got me out of trouble temporarily, but they didn't take balls away from his side, etc. They were passive moves to just delay the inevitable, when one opponent is much stronger than the other.

In Dippy's case, he is clearly overpowered by a mile. His scratch is just going to buy one inning of time. I don't think that means anything considering the vast difference in skill of his current choice of opponents.
Its very hard when you cant make a ball and on top off that its even harder when you cant control the cue ball.

And fight for every ball you make. Nowing the game is one thing but not executing is another.

Its a big spot they are talking about. So I see the game is tough for both players. If dave shoots goog he should win.

If Dave shoots poor he ahould loose. And thats what it will come down too. Who will win because the game is very close. Dave is a seasond money player. And the amount off money wont affect him.

Because he is use too those figures. And too him its just another game. I her what Dave is saying not being able to make balls and execute is very hard on him. And he might even be too hard on himself.

But he loves action. And no matter howe good they play. He sticks with it. Hoping that his shooting will improve.And he loves the chalange off playing champions. I give him a lot off credit for not giving up.

He is also good for pool. And probably bet more money in two months then the champions bet all year. And what I like about him he bets his own money on himself.

I dont no him and I have never seen him play. I no one thing he will gamble and it showes. He does not pick his spots. And If a player beats him. They can win a nice score.

Wright now I make Dave the best action in the country. And he is enjoying himself playing. THats why he has played all these people.

And he comes back for more beacuse he loves one pocket and gambling. It could be his whole life. But no matter what he has woken one pocket up.

And put some interest and life into the game. Dave loves action. And he plays the games he asks for.

And I herd he plays like a gentelmen and never says a word. He is a great man too play with as far as I can See.

And he has money. And whats better then playing a guy with money. Thats a week player. Even if it is a hard game.

Ronnie would have flown too Russia too play a player like that. Even Bugs Corn Bread Red.Thats a pool players dream too play someone like that.

Even with the tough spot. Nobody said it was easy. And he has won and lost with the game.

And the players get backet and get a good chance to win some real money. And without the money. THe game would be nothing nobody would even talk about it.
I hope the action countinues and more money people get involved.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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gulfportdoc said:
Giving a player a free "scratch" would be much different from giving a free "intentional foul". Giving a player all fouls free would indicate a death wish.:D

Doc
Doc,

You might be surprised at how little weight this is. The player receiving it can't shoot balls in his pocket or move them from yours while he's taking fouls. Sooner or later he has to shoot at his pocket.

I've never given it up but I did watch a player my speed did give a weak player 8-3 & scratches don't count. Cornbread set the game up so you know it was a fair game:cool: . They broke out even.

Dennis
 

Cowboy Dennis

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gulfportdoc said:
[This is a question posed by Artie in the Member's Forum, which probably should be in this thread]

John H howe much do you think a sceatch is worth to Dave.

Against a player getting 18 to 4 and the breack. I just want too see what you think and other people think its worth.



This is a very good qouistion. We will see what everyone thinks. And I would like for Dennis SJD John Gost Freddy Gulf Port Bily I Cailread Steve and everyone to give thier opinion and input.

In a game where you are giving up 18-4 or 15-4 or large amounts of weight similar to that, one of the things that the better player counts on is the weaker player fouling several times during the game and decreasing his spot by a ball or two.

I don't think the "one foul don't count" helps him all that much whether he has to call it first or not. Dave looks like he knows how to move and what to shoot, from the one clip I saw of him. I suppose in a tough spot the foul could come in handy but to place a value on it before the game starts, I would say maybe 1/2 a ball per game for a long session.

The whole thing with these games is not what weight Dave is getting and can he win with it, the point is can the good player get his balls when he gets a shot. Running balls is different when you need 18, you need to shoot different patterns and sometimes pass up an easier shot to have the chance to run more balls by shooting a tougher shot. It's a whole different mindset. The weaker player in these type games is ALMOST irrelevant to the game.

Dennis
 

SJDinPHX

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Cowboy Dennis said:
In a game where you are giving up 18-4 or 15-4 or large amounts of weight similar to that, one of the things that the better player counts on is the weaker player fouling several times during the game and decreasing his spot by a ball or two.

I don't think the "one foul don't count" helps him all that much whether he has to call it first or not. Dave looks like he knows how to move and what to shoot, from the one clip I saw of him. I suppose in a tough spot the foul could come in handy but to place a value on it before the game starts, I would say maybe 1/2 a ball per game for a long session.

The whole thing with these games is not what weight Dave is getting and can he win with it, the point is can the good player get his balls when he gets a shot. Running balls is different when you need 18, you need to shoot different patterns and sometimes pass up an easier shot to have the chance to run more balls by shooting a tougher shot. It's a whole different mindset. The weaker player in these type games is ALMOST irrelevant to the game.

Dennis

Dennis is right (for a change:)) Almost any good player, who has 9/7 or 10/7 the best of a given game, will usually still have the best of it playing even, scratches (or fouls) don't count.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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SJDinPHX said:
Dennis is right (for a change:)) Almost any good player, who has 9/7 or 10/7 the best of a given game, will usually still have the best of it playing even, scratches (or fouls) don't count.
The only player that I've seen (on video) that can give up these tremendous amounts of weight is Scott Frost. Alex is capable but Dave says he is out there partying it up every night. Gabe doesn't know enough. Efren is past his prime but could've done it 10 years ago.

Dennis
 

androd

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u12armresl said:
I've seen a no scratches game given by one the best players in the state to a D level player. They agreed on the bet and each time the guy who got no count scratches came up, he would grab the cue ball with his hand and corner hook the other guy in his own hole. They prearranged a set at a price so the other guy couldn't get out of it, and he was such a nice guy, most people would have probably fought over that.

That would be an intentional deliberate double foul. The guy getting spotted wouldn't owe any but the spotter would have CB in hand behind the line. ;)
Rod.
PS, As Artie mentioned,their are many rules that need to be addressed and agreed on before the games begin. :confused:
 

wincardona

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Viffer said:
I caculate my intential scratch is worth 2=+ balls. I know the game better then most people i play i out move themm, not all but most so it makes scratch worth alot.




billy corey beat me 17-4 once again i played and bet all i could and lost,,


the alex i played on virginia wasnt the same one i played in vegas,

yes i beat gabe, but he is the butttom of barrel or players, scott correy alex all better, or harder for me to beat cause then run balls so good
Dippie I suspect that you're going o give Cory another chance at that game based on your gambling pattern. Does Cory play better one pocket than Gabe? You seem to think so because he runs more balls, but consensus says not. But then again like I always say, once you been there and evaluate it, you no longer need to heed the advice of consensus.:)

Anyways now that you lost again, you're actually not so bad of a guy.;) But you need to play Cory the same game again so you can convince people that you have gamble and you really were'nt laying down for a bigger bet.;) Once you do that and lose you'll be recognized as the gambler many percieve you as.:cool: Then you have a chance to really take off a score ( in pool standards) and maybe bring some people down that you would like to beat.:D

PS. I like you more today than yesterday, but will I like you tomorrow?

Billy I.
 

Artie Bodendorfer

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Cowboy Dennis said:
In a game where you are giving up 18-4 or 15-4 or large amounts of weight similar to that, one of the things that the better player counts on is the weaker player fouling several times during the game and decreasing his spot by a ball or two.

I don't think the "one foul don't count" helps him all that much whether he has to call it first or not. Dave looks like he knows how to move and what to shoot, from the one clip I saw of him. I suppose in a tough spot the foul could come in handy but to place a value on it before the game starts, I would say maybe 1/2 a ball per game for a long session.

The whole thing with these games is not what weight Dave is getting and can he win with it, the point is can the good player get his balls when he gets a shot. Running balls is different when you need 18, you need to shoot different patterns and sometimes pass up an easier shot to have the chance to run more balls by shooting a tougher shot. It's a whole different mindset. The weaker player in these type games is ALMOST irrelevant to the game.

Dennis
Thats true you need to position the shots so you can run a lot off balls. This stratagie is also very important playing 8 no count you dont just shoot at every shot.
 

Viffer

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NO im done with corey, im convinced i cant win or i would of never bought out of set. loosing another 15k to try to get a a bigger bet in pool just never could be worth it.

If anyone thinks gabe is better then corey im sure they could win alot if they could prove it.

Seems like none of the top one pocket players like to play each other, you cant judge someones game by a race to 3, a long race people can be ccreative and stuff.


billy, i heard the gambling stories about you chip and stuey, why didnt you tell people about petey.

billy you say i have improved so much since i played scott, what am i doing better? hell tell me the color of the shirt i was wearing one of the times you saw what i was doing better?

guy wins he must be getting better, god forbid the other guy played bad, nope the winner has to be better,

guy win one set out of 40 must adjust 3 balls, you sure sound like someone i want to gamble with.

here is what i will do with you billy, ill tell corey every shot to shoot and he has to shoot what i tell him, and we play you even one pocket,

and to answer you question no you probally wont ever like me, i tell it like it is and you dont want people knowing the truth.
 

wincardona

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Viffer said:
NO im done with corey, im convinced i cant win or i would of never bought out of set. loosing another 15k to try to get a a bigger bet in pool just never could be worth it.

If anyone thinks gabe is better then corey im sure they could win alot if they could prove it.

Seems like none of the top one pocket players like to play each other, you cant judge someones game by a race to 3, a long race people can be ccreative and stuff.


billy, i heard the gambling stories about you chip and stuey, why didnt you tell people about petey.

billy you say i have improved so much since i played scott, what am i doing better? hell tell me the color of the shirt i was wearing one of the times you saw what i was doing better?

guy wins he must be getting better, god forbid the other guy played bad, nope the winner has to be better,

guy win one set out of 40 must adjust 3 balls, you sure sound like someone i want to gamble with.

here is what i will do with you billy, ill tell corey every shot to shoot and he has to shoot what i tell him, and we play you even one pocket,

and to answer you question no you probally wont ever like me, i tell it like it is and you dont want people knowing the truth.

I really don't want to get into another debate with you on how well you play, and how much gamble you have. You played Cory 17 to 4 and after 24 games the score was tied at 12 apiece, so you play a race to 8 and fall behind 7 to 4 and settle the bet. Now you firmly believe that you can't win with Cory trailing 19 to 16 in games won. You definetly need to change the game, I do understand.

As far as your proposal about Corey and me playing even one pocket with you coaching Corey, well I don't think that I can beat a player that is 10 to 6 better then me even if he is coached by you, but there is a game I will play but I haven't heard it yet. I'll just play you 10 to 6 for semi sociable money, how about it? Or i'll shoot inbetween you and Corey even, and he can coach himself. I don't think that these games are out of line.


Billy I.
 

Viffer

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No billy I have played 10 sets with Corey never won one, each time I leave and say he can't keep doing that, well I finally left saying damn!


I will play you as you requested above. Only a few conditions we playboy the game and we play a min if 24 hours per session
 

wincardona

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Viffer said:
No billy I have played 10 sets with Corey never won one, each time I leave and say he can't keep doing that, well I finally left saying damn!


I will play you as you requested above. Only a few conditions we playboy the game and we play a min if 24 hours per session

See, i'm starting to like you more and more, but I can't even sleep for 24 hrs.how am I going to play 24 hr. sets? Now if you bring that down to 8 hr. sets a day for 2 days you got action for semi sociable money. Or i'll play you 10 to 6 for 10 hrs. semi sociable money.

Billy I.
 

breaknrun

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Why so mad?

Why so mad?

I just think your getting a little seasoned playing the champs.

You started off with the toughest one first.

How much pool were you playing before you played Scott?

How much have you played since Scott?

You seem to be a hell of a grinder and mover, and the money doesn't scare you.

I think your pretty good at making games too.

I also don't think Billys comment was a knock. Your big pay days will continue to lure the champs.
 
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