What Would Boost the Participation Rate in a Typical One-Pocket Tournament?

OK, so I've had a few 16-player One-Pocket tournaments in the South Florida area last year with limited success, I'd say. I got a full field in 2 out of the 4 tournaments. The other two had 11 and 15.

I'd like to get your opinions re. what's been working at similar tournaments around the country. I know California Billiards has been able to consistently draw a full field of 32 players. Or am I wrong?

1. The entry fee should be no more than ----.
2. A Calcutta is a must.
3. Keep the entry fee low to draw a large crowd, and focus on the Calcutta.
4. Implement some sort of handicap so that the lower-skilled players get a chance at cashing.
5. OTHER.

Your feedback is appreciated.

Peter

I am just jealous that we don't have something like that closer to me so I could play in some..

I have played in a handicapped tourney before and personally not a big fan as there will always be disputes on what handicap a player should come in at.

I am pretty sure CA Billiards entry is pretty low like $20 or $30? But I could be wrong someone on the west can clarify.

Sounds like if you have filled it twice and missed it by one 3 out of 4 times, that's pretty good results if you ask me. Anyways, good luck with it Peter and hope you get some good ideas from some others!

Seems to me question is....why didnt you fill the 2 times?

Many variables for your options ie. a 20 dollar trnmnt may fill anywhere,a 200 trnmnt only fill in a few places.

Thanks brother.

With a new venue (Park Ave Billiards in Orange Park, FL) willing to add $1,000/event, I'd like to boost it to 32 players. Calcuttas are very popular and can serve to draw a big crowd. I totally agree with not having a handicap.

Peter

cincy_kid said:

I am just jealous that we don't have something like that closer to me so I could play in some..

I have played in a handicapped tourney before and personally not a big fan as there will always be disputes on what handicap a player should come in at.

I am pretty sure CA Billiards entry is pretty low like $20 or $30? But I could be wrong someone on the west can clarify.

Sounds like if you have filled it twice and missed it by one 3 out of 4 times, that's pretty good results if you ask me. Anyways, good luck with it Peter and hope you get some good ideas from some others!

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OneRock said:

OK, so I've had a few 16-player One-Pocket tournaments in the South Florida area last year with limited success, I'd say. I got a full field in 2 out of the 4 tournaments. The other two had 11 and 15.

I'd like to get your opinions re. what's been working at similar tournaments around the country. I know California Billiards has been able to consistently draw a full field of 32 players. Or am I wrong?

1. The entry fee should be no more than ----.
2. A Calcutta is a must.
3. Keep the entry fee low to draw a large crowd, and focus on the Calcutta.
4. Implement some sort of handicap so that the lower-skilled players get a chance at cashing.
5. OTHER.

Your feedback is appreciated.

Peter

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The lower entry fee will bring more players, but you need to at least give weaker players a sporting chance.
Every area has a hand full of really superior players, who are going to win every time .
Even if you only give the fish, half the spot they should be getting, they want to play, they just don't want to give their money away, without some kind of chance.

I used to run tournaments in my 20s. These were my keys to a good tournament.

added money to the tournament will draw players.

Cultivate the calcutta. Some guys just like to bid, not play. Make sure they are contacted and cultivated.

Run the tournament smoothly with no sudden changes.

Just announcing the tournament is not enough. Calling the players and getting their verbal confirmation helps build momentum towards a full field.

Getting the room to have food available for purchase is good because these are long days.

Making sure you have enough tables to play on so that the tournament does not bog down.

Don't move the tournament day around. Settle on a day and make that the regular tournament date. Players hate change.

Have a weekly cheap tourney to get more interest for non 1p players.

I dislike the handicap too, and the inevitable bitching that comes with it, but I'd like to give this a try anyway:

"A" players give up the break. My guess is that you'd pick up at least some "B" players without losing a single "A" and the complaints would be limited to 2 or 3 guys, and not too strident.

If the room owner will give you Friday evening to Sunday evening you can have longer races, which dead money likes.

Another thing for dead money: "2-and-dones" play a mini for 1 1/2 X entry fee, starting as soon as two tables are no longer needed.

Where I play I think $40 entry would be the right amount for max participation.

Peter, as noted, handicapping is difficult and not very satisfactory. A classified event is a possible solution, but not much better - meaning a separate prize fund of some kind, even a separate event run at the same time, maybe. To fill an open tournament, you need to have 32 players who want to play AND have a realistic chance to win at least a match or two. Much easier to find in California than in south Florida.

Low entry fees are the same as small prize funds. Added money will help a little, green fees will hurt. Calcutta and the presence of stake horses can help get the players out. For many of them, travel, meals and an overnite stay mean the chance of even making expenses is pretty slim.

Send out attractive flyers to the area and ask proprietors to post them in their rooms. Compile a roster of names and phone numbers and call them up - or get someone to do it. Promote the event, and be careful what you promise. Best of luck -

It's cool that you and the room are willing to grow onepocket via tournaments. My hats off to you all.

If the room owner is will to add money as you mentioned, maybe make a an end of year tournament w/a pretty good sum $ added to the pot at the same time using monthly tournaments ($20 entry?) as a qualifier. Maybe tto qualify a player must play in at least 4-6 monthly's in the year or they would not be eligible to play the year end bash.

The idea being to generate a lot of interrest in the monthly's so people get used to playing in them and you have a better chance of getting them filled. I would suggest keeping the year end tourney the same low entry fee so not to discourage those that really have no chance.

Good luck,
Dave

California Billiards hosts a monthly 1p tournament on the 3rd Saturday and 9ball on the 3rd Sunday. Open, no handicaps. Race to 2 on both sides. Chris adds $300 to the prize fund and players buy in for $30 or so. I've played 10-12 times in the last two years, and it seems like it draws between 6-20 players. When there are just 6 or so, we've sometimes opted to turn it into a round robin event.

The entry fee is low enough that a few players with little chance to win are still willing to play for the opportunity in every tournament. At the least, every player gets two matches so the experience return on investment is reasonable.

CaliforniaCueSports runs a handicapped 1p league with divisions at California Billiards and the Broken Rack in Emeryville. While no handicap system is perfect, the method employed in the league works pretty good over time. I'm not exactly sure whether the system actually favors the better players, but the higher rated players do tend to do better, but lower ranked players almost always have a chance to win if they play well or get lucky. For instance, the highest rated player would have to spot the lowest rated player 16-5 or 15-5, so anything is possible in a race to 3. I do grumble a bit when I get beat after giving up a spot like that, but I accept that I'm not going to win every match just because I play better than my opponent. Once a player's rating is established, their ratings don't change much anymore unless they start doing something dramatically better or worse over time, so it seems pretty difficult for anyone to sandbag the system. My biggest complaint is when a new player gets assigned a lower rating that underrates their skill level to start out so they get an advantage for the first half or so of their first season. Over time, those players rise to their appropriate level, but I think it would be better if they were given a higher rating on the front end from which point they can go down if their results can't maintain the higher rating.

OneRock said:

OK, so I've had a few 16-player One-Pocket tournaments in the South Florida area last year with limited success, I'd say. I got a full field in 2 out of the 4 tournaments. The other two had 11 and 15.

I'd like to get your opinions re. what's been working at similar tournaments around the country. I know California Billiards has been able to consistently draw a full field of 32 players. Or am I wrong?

1. The entry fee should be no more than ----.
2. A Calcutta is a must.
3. Keep the entry fee low to draw a large crowd, and focus on the Calcutta.
4. Implement some sort of handicap so that the lower-skilled players get a chance at cashing.
5. OTHER.

Your feedback is appreciated.

Peter

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The monthly tournament at CA Billiards usually draws 20 to 32. It drew 38 when he doubled the added $ to $400 because there was no tournament the prior month.

Hard Times in Sacramento draws more on average, high 30’s and sometimes a little more. Hard Times adds $300 and all the $ goes back to the players. The secret, besides having quite a few one pocket players, is they only charge a $20 entry fee for ‘B’ players which makes up a good part of the field. The better players have a $30 entry fee. This works because the tournament director is familiar with everyone’s game and an unknown player has to pay the $30 entry fee. They also pay down quite bit which encourages the players. This month they had 41 players, 1st place paid $340 down to 9 - 12th $35.

John,

That's great to know. In fact, I've been thinking of charging the better players a higher entry fee. Do they run a Calcutta too?

Peter

jrhendy said:

The monthly tournament at CA Billiards usually draws 20 to 32. It drew 38 when he doubled the added $ to $400 because there was no tournament the prior month.

Hard Times in Sacramento draws more on average, high 30’s and sometimes a little more. Hard Times adds $300 and all the $ goes back to the players. The secret, besides having quite a few one pocket players, is they only charge a $20 entry fee for ‘B’ players which makes up a good part of the field. The better players have a $30 entry fee. This works because the tournament director is familiar with everyone’s game and an unknown player has to pay the $30 entry fee. They also pay down quite bit which encourages the players. This month they had 41 players, 1st place paid $340 down to 9 - 12th $35.

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OneRock said:

John,

That's great to know. In fact, I've been thinking of charging the better players a higher entry fee. Do they run a Calcutta too?

Peter

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No players auction at either of these tournaments. As I understand it, not legal in CA.

jrhendy said:

No players auction at either of these tournaments. As I understand it, not legal in CA.

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I'm guessing probably not legal in any US state, (even Nevada without a state license) just a matter of enforcement.

My understanding is that wagering on your own skill is not "gambling" or unlawful in most US jurisdictions, but wagering on someone else's performance is both.

as a dead money guy
i like the idea of paying less to enter......
also you may want to advertise around the rooms in georgia near jacksonville to try and get more players

Sounds like you can run a fun tournament once a month, like California... $30.00 entry fee, no green fees... no handicap...no Calcutta... plenty of time to build interest and get entries...Same day every month... Getting added money would increase interest from the better local players, but not the world beaters, or out of staters... as it’s just to small... you could charge a premium to the better players, ($40.00/$50.00 each) and use that premium, plus the added money to increase the places paid...

I guess it all depends on the size of the entry fee... When the entry fees are $100.00 & up, I believe it would reduce the entries in a monthly tournament...
For $30.00, most people who love to play one pocket, would enjoy testing themselves every month... What’s $30.00 in today’s economy... Zipppp...Ya spend that getting your car washed, and that ain’t no fun at all...

OneRock said:

OK, so I've had a few 16-player One-Pocket tournaments in the South Florida area last year with limited success, I'd say. I got a full field in 2 out of the 4 tournaments. The other two had 11 and 15.

I'd like to get your opinions re. what's been working at similar tournaments around the country. I know California Billiards has been able to consistently draw a full field of 32 players. Or am I wrong?

1. The entry fee should be no more than ----.
2. A Calcutta is a must.
3. Keep the entry fee low to draw a large crowd, and focus on the Calcutta.
4. Implement some sort of handicap so that the lower-skilled players get a chance at cashing.
5. OTHER.

Your feedback is appreciated.

Peter

Click to expand...

If you keep the entry fee down, the lower skill level players will play and the gamblers will focus more on the calcutta. This way lower skilled players get a chance to play top competition for cheap and the gamblers can still make their big $ money in the calcutta where the lower players wont participate. I think that $ being added and advertised gets the attention of players from farther away. It has to be consistent. It has to happen rain or shine on the dates scheduled on a monthly basis at a minimum. It has to start on time and run quickly and efficiently. Also doesnt hurt to check out the competition's schedule of events to identify when you may lose out on participation to another first of the month tourney that is more established for instance. Lots of good suggestions in here that you could implement. Good Luck,

LSJohn said:

I'm guessing probably not legal in any US state, (even Nevada without a state license) just a matter of enforcement.

My understanding is that wagering on your own skill is not "gambling" or unlawful in most US jurisdictions, but wagering on someone else's performance is both.

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They are legal in LA as long as all the money goes back to the participants.