palmer /efren #2

straightback

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owensboro, ky
Look at the 2nd pic. I feel comfortable banking the seven behind the nine and following the cue ball to the rail, getting a ball to my side and hiding it.

Of course if you nick the nine with the seven, you leave a bank and my shot is not a good one.

Looks like Johnny Ervolino in the stands.

Yep, Squirrel bottom left as well.

BTW, nice WWYD - lots of options!
 

lll

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vero beach fl
Look at the 2nd pic. I feel comfortable banking the seven behind the nine and following the cue ball to the rail, getting a ball to my side and hiding it.

Of course if you nick the nine with the seven, you leave a bank and my shot is not a good one.

Looks like Johnny Ervolino in the stands.

EDIT TO BE CLEAR THIS IS JOHN H. SHOT DIAGRAMMED
heres the shot from the overhead angle
and the second pic
jj1.jpg

jj2.jpg
 
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keoneyo

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I would one rail bank the seven into the underside of the five ball and two rail the cue under the thirteen ball? and up table to the end rail. You might open up a ball on his side but the end rail should deter Efren from shooting. You also could make a ball as an "in off" into your pocket. Ticky tacking around with Efren in these situations is dangerous. He often finds shots to play and freeze you in the rack. The strength of his game is playing the stack and he performs less well when forced to play from the end rail. I know because he and I have played and I didn't like the outcome.

Jerry this is the shot I been advocating. The red ball (7) into the orange ball (5) CB coming under the lower stripe ball seems to make sense and can be completed succesfully a great percentage of the time.
The 3 railer is sexy but really not a high percentage shot and If I was Efren would want you to shoot it.
The skim of the 6 and into the stack on the right side is a nice shot as well as taking the scratch 2 rails into the side of the stack but requires good CB control. Its a tight but aggressive shot.
Our shot is very Aggressive, moving the stack towards our hole, and Aggression here can be rewarded.
 

One Pocket Ghost

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The 3 railer is sexy

That's fitting...since as all the lady pool players know (many, over the years, in an up-close-and-personal way :eek:) - the Ghost is sexy...:heh

PS, Sorry guys, for putting that image of the Ghost in your minds...:lol
 
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Patrick Johnson

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That's fitting...since as all the lady pool players know (many, over the years, in an up-close-and-personal way :eek:) - the Ghost is sexy...:heh

PS, Sorry guys, for putting that image of the Ghost in your minds...:lol
Guess that answers the question I've been meaning to ask you about whether Riva reads 1P.org. :eek:

pj <- my (mind's) eyes!!!
chgo
 

keoneyo

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That's fitting...since as all the lady pool players know (many, over the years, in an up-close-and-personal way :eek:) - the Ghost is sexy...:heh

PS, Sorry guys, for putting that image of the Ghost in your minds...:lol

You da man, Ghost!
 

lll

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vero beach fl
palmer decided to come under the 9 as a tiki knocking the 9 away
and continuing off the side rail into the stack
like this
and how he left efren
.....
....
bp4.jpg
........
........
..........

bp6.jpg
 

gulfportdoc

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There's a kiss when I shoot it. I set it up about a dozen times and tried stun, center right, and high right... I kissed over and over.

If the kiss is avoidable, what might I be doing wrong?
John, are you sure that you're placing the 9-ball 1-1/3 diamond back from the pocket, and positioning the CB so that it would shoot the 9 straight in without a cut? I like to shoot the shot with an elevated cue so as to make sure that there's no spin on the CB as it contacts the 9.

~Doc
 

straightback

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A bit risky for my taste. Seems easy to leave the 3 ball or the 6 ball cross corner if you don't get the perfect kick.

Maybe he's just good at these kinda kicks?

It's a fancy shot but it doesn't really DO a whole hell of a lot - Reyes will thin off the 15 and put you on the middle diamond of the end rail, at which point you want to protect the 3 so bad you might have to take an intentional.

Considering the risk taken on this shot, I'd want a bigger payoff myself. Others may be wooed by the fact it's a sexy looking shot that does to Efren what he usually does to others.
 
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LSJohn

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John, are you sure that you're placing the 9-ball 1-1/3 diamond back from the pocket, and positioning the CB so that it would shoot the 9 straight in without a cut? I like to shoot the shot with an elevated cue so as to make sure that there's no spin on the CB as it contacts the 9.

~Doc

Ball positioning looks good. Elevating helps... I just barely kiss. :lol

I have to move CB about an inch up-table to make it work.

:frus
 

Tom Wirth

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So here is another case of a well executed poor decision.
Billy's choice of shot was like having the quarry surrounded and then pulling off the guard to the back door and telling him how to escape.

By removing the threat of the nine ball, Billy has given EF an easy escape route. In addition he has allowed EF in the execution of his own shot to now manage to free a few balls on his own side of the table thereby neutralizing the playing field.

Typically, balls located along the bottom rail should be considered belonging to both players. One of the main objectives for setting traps in One Pocket is to get at least one ball on your side rail and another on the bottom rail. To have multiple balls on either rail adds to the navigation difficulties for an opponent when he becomes trapped in the stack. Billy removed a critical ball from that equation. Bad move.

Someone, forgive me for not remembering who, suggested thinning off the six ball and playing the cue ball two rails into the side of the stack. This is the right idea but in my experience this requires great skill to make such a precise carom. In my opinion it is far easier to find that precise angle and speed with the use of an intentional scratch. Now EF is in a far more potent trap, one from which he may find a temporary haven somewhere, but regardless of where he leaves him, Billy will be in a far better position to strengthen his hold on EF.

The red line in the image shows what I call the catchers mitt. I am always looking for simplistic ways to put my opponent in the web of this mitt, particularly when I have balls on both my side rail and the bottom rail. And I'm not fond of having to remove any part of my trap to accomplish this task, especially when I have other paths to the same cue ball position.

BTW; anyone who has not developed a good feel for this particular type of kick shot is not yet a One Pocket player. This shot is one of the more common kicks in the game and must be an arrow in the quiver of players of all skill levels. If you don't know it, learn it!

Tom
 

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Tom Wirth

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I wish to add one more comment to my previous post.
Overkill is not necessary! Meaning Billy had enough balls in position to set a very effective trap without taking a super aggressive posture or a need for anything fancy with his shot. The old adage of "keep it simple" works fine here.

Tom
 

wincardona

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Dallas Tx.
So here is another case of a well executed poor decision.
Billy's choice of shot was like having the quarry surrounded and then pulling off the guard to the back door and telling him how to escape.

By removing the threat of the nine ball, Billy has given EF an easy escape route. In addition he has allowed EF in the execution of his own shot to now manage to free a few balls on his own side of the table thereby neutralizing the playing field. (I agree 100% with your analysis, Billy actually weakened his position with his choice for the exact reasons you brought forward)

Typically, balls located along the bottom rail should be considered belonging to both players. One of the main objectives for setting traps in One Pocket is to get at least one ball on your side rail and another on the bottom rail. To have multiple balls on either rail adds to the navigation difficulties for an opponent when he becomes trapped in the stack. Billy removed a critical ball from that equation. Bad move.( That's what I just said:lol)

Someone, forgive me for not remembering who, suggested thinning off the six ball and playing the cue ball two rails into the side of the stack. This is the right idea but in my experience this requires great skill to make such a precise carom. In my opinion it is far easier to find that precise angle and speed with the use of an intentional scratch. Now EF is in a far more potent trap, one from which he may find a temporary haven somewhere, but regardless of where he leaves him, Billy will be in a far better position to strengthen his hold on EF.

The red line in the image shows what I call the catchers mitt. I am always looking for simplistic ways to put my opponent in the web of this mitt, particularly when I have balls on both my side rail and the bottom rail. And I'm not fond of having to remove any part of my trap to accomplish this task, especially when I have other paths to the same cue ball position.

BTW; anyone who has not developed a good feel for this particular type of kick shot is not yet a One Pocket player. This shot is one of the more common kicks in the game and must be an arrow in the quiver of players of all skill levels. If you don't know it, learn it!

Tom
Where have you been Tom? Can't wait to read your book on "The art of playing aggressively" Of course that's not the name of your book but that's my own interpretation of what it's all about. ;):focus

I also like the intentional in this spot, and the 9ball is one of the key balls that would influence me to make the decision with taking the intentional. Dan suggested to play off the 6ball to get there, I agreed, but only if you're sure of controlling the cue ball to get there..if not then take the intentional, it's definitely worth a loss of a ball to get the cue ball to where it needs to be. ;)

Positioning the cue ball in the stack from the position referenced is a very strong shot especially when you consider the limited options that are available. The intentional will protect your position and put the onus back on your opponent and who knows what his answer to your shot would be..for certain it can't hurt you but it could easily help you win the game if he tries something he shouldn't. That's the hidden percentage that many players over look, and doing that they lose not only a good move but they just might save a bad move by doing something forcefully. Sorta like what Palmer just did.:sorry

Dr. Bill
 

Tom Wirth

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Where have you been Tom? Can't wait to read your book on "The art of playing aggressively" Of course that's not the name of your book but that's my own interpretation of what it's all about. ;):focus

Dr. Bill

Dr. Bill, Thank you for plugging the upcoming book. You are a good man Charlie Brown. My editor has it at present and he called me yesterday to inform me that I should be getting it back within a few days. After that it shouldn't be long before I will send it to the printers and be taking formal orders.

I will keep you all updated on the progress.

Tom
 
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