Game 1 Danny D. v/s Ronnie Allen, Golden 8 Ball 1988

PoolSleuth

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I think the year was 1988 when Danny D. & Ronnie Allen played in PHX at the Golden 8 BALL. Game one ended with a shot by Danny I can not figure out how Danny pulled off this 4 CUSHION SHOT.

How did Danny make the shot?

English?

My Drawing is crude, but I think good enough!
 

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Fast Lenny

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PoolSleuth said:
I think the year was 1988 when Danny D. & Ronnie Allen played in PHX at the Golden 8 BALL. Game one ended with a shot by Danny I can not figure out how Danny pulled off this 4 CUSHION SHOT.

How did Danny make the shot?

English?

My Drawing is crude, but I think good enough!
If your at Kolbys ever I will show you the shot as I have done it a few times,its not easy on a tight table though,you have hit right after the side pocket,it goes in the side alot when you dont hit it perfect which is tough to do. :)
 

gulfportdoc

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PoolSleuth said:
I think the year was 1988 when Danny D. & Ronnie Allen played in PHX at the Golden 8 BALL. Game one ended with a shot by Danny I can not figure out how Danny pulled off this 4 CUSHION SHOT.

How did Danny make the shot?
I believe that the only way this shot goes is if the table is "wet". In other words there has to be fairly high humidity for the OB to come short off the 3rd and 4th rails. That shot is probably not very often makeable in Arizona...:D

If the match was in Arizona, then the lights, spectators, or poor A/C must have contributed to the moisture in the air. Jay Helfert could probably tell us about the humid conditions, since he was the promoter/referee.

Doc
 

Cowboy Dennis

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I have the match in question on tape and anyone who has seen it will probably remember Ronnie Allen mentioning several times the wet table. That shot can be made with the fourth rail being the other side of the side pocket. But the only way it can be made like it was, was for the humidity to make the ball pull up that short off of the fourth rail. It was creative, given the conditions.
 

One Pocket Ghost

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PoolSleuth said:
I think the year was 1988 when Danny D. & Ronnie Allen played in PHX at the Golden 8 BALL. Game one ended with a shot by Danny I can not figure out how Danny pulled off this 4 CUSHION SHOT.

How did Danny make the shot?

English?

My Drawing is crude, but I think good enough!



Sleuth.......I posted about this bank shot a couple of weeks ago....go to >>> http://www.onepocket.org/forum/showthread.php?p=16818#post16818

- Ghost
 

jrhendy

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gulfportdoc said:
I believe that the only way this shot goes is if the table is "wet". In other words there has to be fairly high humidity for the OB to come short off the 3rd and 4th rails. That shot is probably not very often makeable in Arizona...:D

If the match was in Arizona, then the lights, spectators, or poor A/C must have contributed to the moisture in the air. Jay Helfert could probably tell us about the humid conditions, since he was the promoter/referee.

Doc

Doc, the guy that put me in the losers bracket at your tournament at Skeeter's made this shot on his game ball in one of the games he won.

This was when I realized he wasn't a "C" player and before he was bumped up to a "B"
 

philwelch

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PoolSleuth said:
I think the year was 1988 when Danny D. & Ronnie Allen played in PHX at the Golden 8 BALL. Game one ended with a shot by Danny I can not figure out how Danny pulled off this 4 CUSHION SHOT.

How did Danny make the shot?

English?

My Drawing is crude, but I think good enough!
That's a common one pocket shot. My mentor Reno used to shoot this alot.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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philwelch said:
That's a common one pocket shot. My mentor Reno used to shoot this alot.
It is not a common one-pocket shot for the ball to hit that side of the side pocket. It is common for it to hit the other side and flip over, as we used to describe it. Then it opens up and goes towards the hole.
 

SJDinPHX

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That shot is tough on a dry table !

That shot is tough on a dry table !

philwelch said:
That's a common one pocket shot. My mentor Reno used to shoot this alot.

The humidity was very high for Phoenix that week ( above 70%) and the A/C was onthe blink. RA used up several towels. Table conditions were VERY wet.

Dick
 

bernie p

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SJDinPHX said:
The humidity was very high for Phoenix that week ( above 70%) and the A/C was onthe blink. RA used up several towels. Table conditions were VERY wet.

Dick


Hi Dick,

It appears that I'm wrong, but I thought I remember Danny inadvertently making that 4 railer of the middle pocket teet.

The only reason I say that is I have never seen that shot made on a gold crown. I know that a diamond table for example, banks much shorter, presumably making this shot much more feasible.

Anybody out there with diamond experience that can testify....?

Thanks.

Bernie.
 

Cowboy Dennis

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bernie p said:
Hi Dick,

It appears that I'm wrong, but I thought I remember Danny inadvertently making that 4 railer of the middle pocket teet.

The only reason I say that is I have never seen that shot made on a gold crown. I know that a diamond table for example, banks much shorter, presumably making this shot much more feasible.

Anybody out there with diamond experience that can testify....?

Thanks.

Bernie.
I have not watched it in a while but I recall Danny D. making that ball with it hitting the fourth rail well past the side pocket. And Diamond tables do play shorter than any other tables I have played on. I don't recall ever shooting this shot on a diamond but I wouldn't be surprised if it went the same as on a wet gold crown.
 

newfosgatesucks

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I can vouch it goes on a Gold crown. To boot it cost me quite a bit....

The only reason I say that is I have never seen that shot made on a gold crown. I know that a diamond table for example, banks much shorter, presumably making this shot much more feasible.

Anybody out there with diamond experience that can testify....?

Thanks.

Bernie.[/QUOTE]
 

PoolSleuth

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gulfportdoc said:
I believe that the only way this shot goes is if the table is "wet". In other words there has to be fairly high humidity for the OB to come short off the 3rd and 4th rails. That shot is probably not very often makeable in Arizona...:D

If the match was in Arizona, then the lights, spectators, or poor A/C must have contributed to the moisture in the air. Jay Helfert could probably tell us about the humid conditions, since he was the promoter/referee.

Doc

Yes Doc the Golden 8 Ball, NOW CLOSED was in Phoenix. Believe it or NOT about 6-8 Weeks during Moonsoon Season Phoenix is VERY HIMID. Not sure what time of year the event was.
 

Fast Lenny

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PoolSleuth said:
Yes Doc the Golden 8 Ball, NOW CLOSED was in Phoenix. Believe it or NOT about 6-8 Weeks during Moonsoon Season Phoenix is VERY HIMID. Not sure what time of year the event was.
I made it tonight,I was told that I caught the point and made it,its a very low percentage shot.....for me anyways. :)
 

gulfportdoc

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bernie p said:
Anybody out there with diamond experience that can testify....?
Bernie, the shot doesn't go on a dry Diamond either. The table has to be at least a little wet. Whether or not it's easier to make the shot on a Diamond over a Gold Crown, I couldn't say.

Doc
 

iusedtoberich

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Right after the shot was made, one of the players said it only went because it was so wet in there.

Its been a year or so since I watched this match, but like others have said, it was super humid in there.

The same bank is on Winning One Pocket in a short story about Eddie Taylor trapping the fellow pro players at one of the tournaments with this shot.
 

SJDinPHX

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gulfportdoc said:
Bernie, the shot doesn't go on a dry Diamond either. The table has to be at least a little wet. Whether or not it's easier to make the shot on a Diamond over a Gold Crown, I couldn't say.

Doc

Doubt if it makes much difference, but unless they changed it for that event, the table in the pit at the G-8 Ball was NOT a Gold Crown. It was a Brunswick Anniversary model. I will look at it later today and double check.
If every thing lays right, I have shot that shot many times, but usually just hoping to get it close to my hole, and leave my opponent on the end rail.
I dont remember ever making it on a dry table without catching the point of the side pocket. Shooting it warp speed, will increase your chances a little, but the ball won't wind up near your hole if you do.
If its the last ball on the table, and you shoot it too firm, you will hit about a diamond away from your pocket (on the short rail) and may serve up a 1 railer, off the long rail, toward your opponents pocket.

Dick <---likes to play it, but don't expect to make it on ANY dry table. On a damp, or wet table, it is VERY playable.
 
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jay helfert

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PoolSleuth said:
I think the year was 1988 when Danny D. & Ronnie Allen played in PHX at the Golden 8 BALL. Game one ended with a shot by Danny I can not figure out how Danny pulled off this 4 CUSHION SHOT.

How did Danny make the shot?

English?

My Drawing is crude, but I think good enough!


First of all the table was a Centennial. Danny played that shot just like you are shooting a three railer at the side pocket, and aim a hair long. He hit it much closer to the side then is shown here, maybe an inch above the point. You can actually hit this shot short (as much as half a diamond) on a Diamond table, because they play so short.
 

SJDinPHX

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jay helfert said:
First of all the table was a Centennial. Danny played that shot just like you are shooting a three railer at the side pocket, and aim a hair long. He hit it much closer to the side then is shown here, maybe an inch above the point. You can actually hit this shot short (as much as half a diamond) on a Diamond table, because they play so short.

Meant to say Centennial instead of Anniversary. Sorry Jay, I have to see that shot made on ANY dry table, or fresh cloth.
If its played any where near pocket speed, you will hit anywhere between 1/2 diamond, or more away from the pocket on the short rail.
Please try it on your new Diamond Pro. I am not that familiar with that table, but I will be very surprised if it is easily makable.
I have shot it many times, and if all the rails are in good shape and the table is dry, you have to catch right below the tit of the side where it starts to round into the point.
If the table is wet, you can hit a full diamond below the side pocket and still make it. varying degrees of wet and damp as opposed to dry, will greatly effect where that shot goes.

Dick

PS The years I spent in Houston (humidity usually matched or exceeded the temp.) that shot was almost a gimme, if you knew the table.
You could hit anywhere from 1/2 diamond to over a diamond below the side, and still make it. I will bet Androd will agree with me on this. With modern A/C and de-humidifiers a lot of the moisture can be removed from an upscale pool room.
However, in older days, almost all rooms in the Gulf coast area, had wet playing tables, except the Le Cue, which had good A/C and a DH system. (When it was working right) Even those tables were rarely completely dry.
 
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androd

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Dampness or worse

Dampness or worse

SJDinPHX said:
Meant to say Centennial instead of Anniversary. Sorry Jay, I have to see that shot made on ANY dry table, or fresh cloth.
If its played any where near pocket speed, you will hit anywhere between 1/2 diamond, or more away from the pocket on the short rail.
Please try it on your new Diamond Pro. I am not that familiar with that table, but I will be very surprised if it is easily makable.
I have shot it many times, and if all the rails are in good shape and the table is dry, you have to catch right below the tit of the side where it starts to round into the point.
If the table is wet, you can hit a full diamond below the side pocket and still make it. varying degrees of wet and damp as opposed to dry, will greatly effect where that shot goes.

Dick

PS The years I spent in Houston (humidity usually matched or exceeded the temp.) that shot was almost a gimme, if you knew the table.
You could hit anywhere from 1/2 diamond to over a diamond below the side, and still make it. I will bet Androd will agree with me on this. With modern A/C and de-humidifiers a lot of the moisture can be removed from an upscale pool room.
However, in older days, almost all rooms in the Gulf coast area, had wet playing tables, except the Le Cue, which had good A/C and a DH system. (When it was working right) Even those tables were rarely completely dry.

Dick, you are correct, late night at the LeCue were sometimes brutal, thats why few road players could beat the talent there that was used to the damp or sometimes wet tables. this list that didn't win includes Bugs.
PS; I've shot that 4 railer many times as have you.
Rodney---> prefers dry tables in his dotage.
 
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