jeremy/efren

wincardona

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Aug 7, 2007
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Dallas Tx.
ball score jeremy 0....efren -2
jeremy's shot
View attachment 14334

I like this wwyd it presents a situation where it's contestable whether to bank the 1ball into the stack or play some other less risky option that carries a positive. Imo banking the 1ball into the stack is a good gamble because of several reasons, i'll explain. I would first use a medium , to medium soft speed with the hit to lessen the chance of kicking the 9ball out near my opponents pocket. With this speed you figure to open up several balls to your side, this would be sufficient since there are already balls positioned on your side of the table, particularly the ball close to your pocket near the bottom rail. The 8ball and the 4ball next to the 8ball are set up nicely for banks to your pocket which would be a deterrant for your opponent in subsequent innings. The table layout favors the shooter and with a controlled power bank it could turn out very good. Leaving a good return bank would be unlucky since the cue ball will be left high on the side rail (close to the rail) imo it's time to gamble but most importantly play the shot with the right speed and play a good cue ball. The stack will protect most balls that will be in position on your side, this option should work well a very high percentage of the time.

This option unlike other options will protect your advantage, double banking the 4ball will leave the balls on your side of the table unprotected and easily moved.

Dr. Bill
 
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1pwannabe

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Oct 17, 2015
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887
100% agree with Dr Bill here, bank the 1 into stack to move some balls, but don't hit this one very hard.

I like this wwyd it presents a situation where it's contestable whether to bank the 1ball into the stack or play some other less risky option that carries a positive. Imo banking the 1ball into the stack is a good gamble because of several reasons, i'll explain. I would first use a medium , to medium soft speed with the hit to lessen the chance of kicking the 9ball out near my opponents pocket. With this speed you figure to open up several balls to your side, this would be sufficient since there are already balls positioned on your side of the table, particularly the ball close to your pocket near the bottom rail. The 8ball and the 4ball next to the 8ball are set up nicely for banks to your pocket which would be a deterrant for your opponent in subsequent innings. The table layout favors the shooter and with a controlled power bank it could turn out very good. Leaving a good return bank would be unlucky since the cue ball will be left high on the side rail (close to the rail) imo it's time to gamble but most importantly play the shot with the right speed and play a good cue ball. The stack will protect most balls that will be in position on your side, this option should work well a very high percentage of the time.

This option unlike other options will protect your advantage, double banking the 4ball will leave the balls on your side of the table unprotected and easily moved.

Dr. Bill
 

Jeff sparks

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Apr 2, 2015
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3,317
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Houston, Texas
I like this wwyd it presents a situation where it's contestable whether to bank the 1ball into the stack or play some other less risky option that carries a positive. Imo banking the 1ball into the stack is a good gamble because of several reasons, i'll explain. I would first use a medium , to medium soft speed with the hit to lessen the chance of kicking the 9ball out near my opponents pocket. With this speed you figure to open up several balls to your side, this would be sufficient since there are already balls positioned on your side of the table, particularly the ball close to your pocket near the bottom rail. The 8ball and the 4ball next to the 8ball are set up nicely for banks to your pocket which would be a deterrant for your opponent in subsequent innings. The table layout favors the shooter and with a controlled power bank it could turn out very good. Leaving a good return bank would be unlucky since the cue ball will be left high on the side rail (close to the rail) imo it's time to gamble but most importantly play the shot with the right speed and play a good cue ball. The stack will protect most balls that will be in position on your side, this option should work well a very high percentage of the time.

This option unlike other options will protect your advantage, double banking the 4ball will leave the balls on your side of the table unprotected and easily moved.

Dr. Bill

I don't care for this bank, although if it's hit perfect with the one ball entering the stack between the high stripe and the lower stripe it should open up balls to your side and protect your position. This is probably the correct shot, I'm just not comfortable shooting it and I'll try to explain why.

The stack appears to be configured in a very tight cluster and sometimes when I've tried this shot coming from this particular angle I have gotten less than optimum results. By that I mean not many balls opened to my side and none moved close enough to my pocket to prevent an easy escape for my opponent. Sometimes the high stripe will be hit with the 1 ball, giving up a bank that's free on either the 1 ball, or the stripe. Also if no ball opens to your long rail then the 8 ball could easily be two railed by your opponent.

I would take a shot at extending my lead here, if not successful I understand I would be giving up my positional advantage, but I'm playing Efren and he's going to out move me about 90% of the time.

I'm banking the 8 ball with low lhe, drawing back down table for shape on the 4 ball. If I make the 8, I get the 4 and then possibly the high stripe and then I open up the stack and leave him stuck in it. Best case is, I'm up 3 to his -2 and have great position, worst case, I miss the 8 ball bank and he clears the 4 ball and I'm still up 0 to -2. Just sayin.... WIWD
 
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FastEddieF.

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Jul 30, 2009
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See if I can kick and stick behind 1 ball or bank 1 ball head on and stick banking 1 ball 2 rails and try and make ball by my pocket.
 

Tom Wirth

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Jul 5, 2004
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From
Delray Beach, Florida
I have a third take on this position. The one ball isn't going anywhere if I can trap Efren on the eight ball. I'm inclined to two rail the four and draw the cue ball behind the eight. The key to this shot is the cue ball not the four. All I want to do with the four is get it along my side rail. It would be somewhat unfortunate if I don't hook him but with the four looming large and no second shot to be had, he is not shooting at the one ball, that I can all but guarantee. So he will try to clear the four. I can live with that.

On the other hand, if I do hook him, he will be forced to deal with two balls, one on either side of my hole and how he handles that I would enjoy seeing. Now I have more options if he leaves me up table and straight in on the four. I can still continue the trap by banking the one as described earlier.

Tom
 

Cowboy Dennis

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Dec 16, 2008
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Detroit,Michigan
If the angles and ratios were there to shoot this it's what I would do everytime. Otherwise I'd bank the 8 and leave him long and straight in on the 1.


jj.jpg
 

onepockethacker

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Jan 31, 2012
Messages
3,408
I have a third take on this position. The one ball isn't going anywhere if I can trap Efren on the eight ball. I'm inclined to two rail the four and draw the cue ball behind the eight. The key to this shot is the cue ball not the four. All I want to do with the four is get it along my side rail. It would be somewhat unfortunate if I don't hook him but with the four looming large and no second shot to be had, he is not shooting at the one ball, that I can all but guarantee. So he will try to clear the four. I can live with that.

On the other hand, if I do hook him, he will be forced to deal with two balls, one on either side of my hole and how he handles that I would enjoy seeing. Now I have more options if he leaves me up table and straight in on the four. I can still continue the trap by banking the one as described earlier.

Tom

Tom that was the first shot I saw.. the only thing is I think we would have to cut the ball a liittle too much to get the angle we need to get it to our side meaning the cue ball will be harder to stop and control to get the hook behind the 8... If the cue ball was an inch or 2 to the left I would shoot it for sure because it would have the perfect angle for the snooker.. The next shot I saw was playing the 1 ball 2/3 rails to the first diamond on my side rail and using the stack to hook him from seeing the 1 or the 4 ball by my side.. with a ball on each side that close and him unable to see them he would be in trouble... however again I think the cue ball needs to be an inch or two again lower(meaning closer to the stack) to have the right angle to pull off the shot and use the stack to hook him from seeing them...
So I think Billy has the best shot in this instance with the exact position of the balls.. If the cue ball was an inch or two one way or the other I would choose one of the other two options... getting a ball on each side of your pocket and your opponent unable to get at them is a really powerful position..

P.S. I might as well point out for some players that dont know or realize yet that one on each side of your opponent and your opponent unable to see them is so strong but unfortunately players will have this position and instead of keeping the opponent hooked they will try to put an extra ball by their hole but leave the cue ball open and their opponent the ability to get at the balls... once you get one on each side of your hole hooking the cue ball is more valuable than getting an extra ball by your hole..
 

LSJohn

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Aug 15, 2013
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monett missouri
I don't care for this bank, although if it's hit perfect with the one ball entering the stack between the high stripe and the lower stripe it should open up balls to your side and protect your position. This is probably the correct shot, I'm just not comfortable shooting it and I'll try to explain why.

The stack appears to be configured in a very tight cluster and sometimes when I've tried this shot coming from this particular angle I have gotten less than optimum results. By that I mean not many balls opened to my side and none moved close enough to my pocket to prevent an easy escape for my opponent. Sometimes the high stripe will be hit with the 1 ball, giving up a bank that's free on either the 1 ball, or the stripe. Also if no ball opens to your long rail then the 8 ball could easily be two railed by your opponent.

Either Jeff's gotten dumber or I've gotten smarter. I had every one of those thoughts.

I would take a shot at extending my lead here, if not successful I understand I would be giving up my positional advantage, but I'm playing Efren and he's going to out move me about 90% of the time.

I'm banking the 8 ball with low lhe, drawing back down table for shape on the 4 ball. If I make the 8, I get the 4 and then possibly the high stripe and then I open up the stack and leave him stuck in it. Best case is, I'm up 3 to his -2 and have great position, worst case, I miss the 8 ball bank and he clears the 4 ball and I'm still up 0 to -2. Just sayin.... WIWD

Too demanding for me. I would softly bank the 1 around the stack using one tip or less of 2 o'clock. I think a good hit sends CB right toward the middle of the stack but short of the lower stripe and leaves the 1 hidden out in front of my pocket.
 

1pwannabe

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Oct 17, 2015
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P.S. I might as well point out for some players that dont know or realize yet that one on each side of your opponent and your opponent unable to see them is so strong but unfortunately players will have this position and instead of keeping the opponent hooked they will try to put an extra ball by their hole but leave the cue ball open and their opponent the ability to get at the balls... once you get one on each side of your hole hooking the cue ball is more valuable than getting an extra ball by your hole..

Absolutely, pure 1P knowledge right here. Wanna see a good 1P player squirm? Put a ball high and low around your pocket and don't let him see either of them.
 

1pwannabe

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Oct 17, 2015
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Jeff makes a really good point about playing Efren and opening the balls up..but then I feel like I would lose 100% of the time playing for 2-3 balls at a time. Maybe I would lose 100% of the time either way so it's moot.

Either Jeff's gotten dumber or I've gotten smarter. I had every one of those thoughts.



Too demanding for me. I would softly bank the 1 around the stack using one tip or less of 2 o'clock. I think a good hit sends CB right toward the middle of the stack but short of the lower stripe and leaves the 1 hidden out in front of my pocket.
 

1pwannabe

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Oct 17, 2015
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I resized it:/QUOTE]

Adding in the tangent lines for the shot, and with top english it will lengthen the angle slightly, it's a sellout methinks.

 

gulfportdoc

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Jun 25, 2004
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Gulfport, Mississippi
Good layout, Larry. Lots of options.

Like Cardone, I'm wanting to bank the 1-ball into the stack. But the more I look at the angle, it looks a little hinky. To bank the 1 into the sweet spot of the stack may result in a CB/1-ball double kiss. I'd have to take it to the table to see. If the angle is not conducive, the shot would have to be hit with draw, which limits where the CB can be left. However if the angle is okay, then I really like that shot.

If the angle is not on, then I like the shot Eddie and Rob alluded to. Simply stick the CB off the 1-ball --hopefully laying the CB on the rail-- and banking the 1-ball 2 rails to my side.

I'd also probably spend some time talking myself out of shooting the 8-ball straight back and rolling the CB over to the opponent's head corner pocket, leaving him straight in on the one. I'd probably abandon the shot, realizing that if the 8 didn't pocket, the opponent would then have an open invitation to knock the 8 and/or the 5 away from my hole.

~Doc
 
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