My ONE time gambling with Ronnie Allen

mr3cushion · Sep 11, 2014

I saw a post someone started on AZB, regarding if Ronnie could play 9 ball as well as 1 Hole. It caught my eye because the OP didn't spell RA's last name correctly.

The other thing I noticed, is that John H. posted this reply to the OP about Ronnie.

Yesterday, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richiebalto View Post
I know that Ronnies 1 pocket game was Awesom, how about Ronnies 9 ball game?

Did Ronnie win any big 9 ball tournaments, iam asking this cause I don't know, nothing else!

Ronnie is one of my all time favorite pool players!

Ps I hope I didn't spell his last name wrong.

Ronnie Allen is most known for his one pocket, but was very good at nine ball, snooker and golf on a snooker table. He also was a very good golfer.

I am sure he won some. 9 ball tournaments along the way, but playing for the cash was his best game.

I met him in the late 50's
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John Henderson

I had a good chuckle to myself when I saw the, (highlighted in black) comment John made about RA's golf game!

From 1987-1990 I was the manager of "Hollywood Billiards" in LA. I mentioned before that a real good Thai player and gambler "Smitty" hung around at the time. I noticed Smitty used to come in with 4 or 5 other Thai guys about the same time everyday about 2-3 in the afternoon, dressed in "Golf" clothes and shoes sometimes. I said to Smitty, "I didn't know you played Golf," He said, "I just started, but, these guys play all the time and are beating me out of my money every week!"

Anyway, I got invited to start playing 2 or 3 times a week with those guys and it became fairly profitable for me and Smitty! At that time we were playing at "Montebello" golf course.

One day I'm there early on the putting green, and who do I see come walking up on the green but, James Brown AKA "Texas Blood!" I'd known "Blood" for years from when He hung around "Bensingers" for awhile. He started, shucking and jiving in His usual manner as soon as He saw me. Not ten minutes later, who comes strolling out of the club house with a six-pack under his arm but none other than, "RA." His usual type of a first crack, "This games got holes, what are you doing here?" He says, "Just kidding, I knew you could play." Well, RA and Blood heard I'd been out here trimming the Thai guys and they wanted in, but, neither Smitty or I were going for that, not after I laid down all the ground work!

Well, typical small time hustlers, they tried to hustle me to play. They both started "poor mouthing" how they both needed a spot. I had heard that Blood could play a little, around a 8-10 handicap, and Ronnie was a mid-eighties player at best. They didn't figure on the game that I had, so, we came to a game. I gave Blood 2 a side and Ronnie 3, but, I wanted to play a "Nassau", front, back and for the 18 holes, $500.00 each, and we POST up with Smitty!

They didn't have enough money for a "Nassau" game, just for 9 holes, I played Blood for $1,000.00 and RA for $500.00. So, we go to the first tee, Blood wins the toss and goes first, then it's Ronnie's turn. Now, that day was a somewhat overcast day, but, when RA took the head-cover off his driver it was glistening like sunshine its self! I took a second look at his driver and ALL the rest of his clubs. Ronnie had put "Vaseline" on ALL his clubs! Now, for those that don't play golf, when you put Vaseline on a club, especially the "Driver" it keeps the ball going straighter. I couldn't believe RA thought I'd go for that, anyway, he was pissed, but the money was up.

Long story short, Ronnie pissed and moaned and sharked throughout the entire round, on the other hand, Blood took it like a man and gentlemen. I snapped back Blood a C-note and Ronnie home with his greasy clubs!

Ronnie cheated and sharked just as good on the golf course as in the pool room, just not as LOUDLY!

beatle · Sep 11, 2014

xxxxxx

Ross Keith Thompson · Sep 12, 2014

Ronnie's 9 ball game

Ronnie's 9 ball game

Johnston city 1970 I played Ronnie in the all around. Before our final match for the championship I sat and watched as Lassiter and Ronnie Played 11 of 21 in their match for the chance to play me in the final match. Ronnie won first break and hit Lassiter with 3 racks I believe. From that point on they both swapped 2 or 3 racks a piece until Ronnie pulled the match out late with 2 racks I believe. The point is that Ronnie could play any body in the world 9 ball or 14 and 1 with any body, he just didn't care for these games like he did one pocket which he was the master in his prime no doubt about it. He would have won some and lost some to the top 9 ball players in his time even though he refused to knock heads with them, He could have beaten Myself on any given day, or Cole Dickson, Rempe, Kelly, Cardona, Billy Johnson, Hall and so on. Most of these guys would have been the favorite to beat him but who could make a living playing any of these guys even nine ball every day. The answer is no body! (LAUGHING) Ronnie could run a hundred balls or 5 racks of 9 ball but he would rather give you a ball playing one pocket! He did shark people and pop off while they were shooting and that was classless of him. He popped off to me in our final match in Johnston City until the end. I miss Ronnie and forgive him for what he did. I will always remember him as one of the greatest players ever, no matter the game he could play it with the best us.

mr3cushion · Sep 12, 2014

beatle said:
gamblers rules in golf. you can use grease on your clubs and every shot is played down no matter where the ball lays. and any amount of clubs in the bag.
thats the way it goes for the big action.

ronnie could shoot maybe not at the time bill played him, in the 70's easily from the whites. mostly shot in the eighties on the lemon.

he remembered me one time from gambling but couldnt place me but ran into me on the putting green. he left with his putter at least.

after that he was always trying to double steer me when he saw me someplace.

If Ronnie played better golf than he did that day, he could of won pretty good.
I knew a guy once, that played the "lemon" so good, he could NEVER come off it!

BTW, anyone that allows themselves to be cheated, deserves to lose their money!

NH Steve · Sep 12, 2014

Ross Keith Thompson said:
Johnston city 1970 I played Ronnie in the all around. Before our final match for the championship I sat and watched as Lassiter and Ronnie Played 11 of 21 in their match for the chance to play me in the final match. Ronnie won first break and hit Lassiter with 3 racks I believe. From that point on they both swapped 2 or 3 racks a piece until Ronnie pulled the match out late with 2 racks I believe. The point is that Ronnie could play any body in the world 9 ball or 14 and 1 with any body, he just didn't care for these games like he did one pocket which he was the master in his prime no doubt about it. He would have won some and lost some to the top 9 ball players in his time even though he refused to knock heads with them, He could have beaten Myself on any given day, or Cole Dickson, Rempe, Kelly, Cardona, Billy Johnson, Hall and so on. Most of these guys would have been the favorite to beat him but who could make a living playing any of these guys even nine ball every day. The answer is no body! (LAUGHING) Ronnie could run a hundred balls or 5 racks of 9 ball but he would rather give you a ball playing one pocket! He did shark people and pop off while they were shooting and that was classless of him. He popped off to me in our final match in Johnston City until the end. I miss Ronnie and forgive him for what he did. I will always remember him as one of the greatest players ever, no matter the game he could play it with the best us.

Thank you Keith -- it is great to hear things like this first hand. Ronnie actually won the 9-Ball division at the Jansco's 1966 Stardust tournament, which qualified him for the finals, and indeed he went on to capture the all-around title for that year. Surprisingly, his clinching win for the all-around title came over Cicero Murphy at the game of Straight Pool, another example that Ronnie was one of the top all-around players of his day.

Sorry for the mini hijack

mr3cushion · Sep 12, 2014

In that same thread about Ronnie, I read this morning a guy pt109 posted this.

Ronnie ALLEN

Ronnie didn't like 9-ball....but I know of a 7- pack he ran for serious cash.

If someone played Ronnie an all-round of Ronnie's seven best games when he played
his best, I can't think of anyone who could have beaten him.

Little known fact....Ronnie may have been the best one-handed 3-cushion player that ever lived.

I spit my OJ all over my shirt when I read this statement!

The ONLY games "RA" could have beaten Artie at, "one-handed" were, 9 ball and golf on the snooker table, until Artie figured out the game! :sorry

In the one-handed 3C, Ronnie could have gotten 2 to 1 on the money, and robbed! :lol:lol:lol

gulfportdoc · Sep 12, 2014

NH Steve said:
Thank you Keith -- it is great to hear things like this first hand. Ronnie actually won the 9-Ball division at the Jansco's 1966 Stardust tournament, which qualified him for the finals, and indeed he went on to capture the all-around title for that year. Surprisingly, his clinching win for the all-around title came over Cicero Murphy at the game of Straight Pool, another example that Ronnie was one of the top all-around players of his day.
...

I could be mistaken, but it seems to me that they talked RA into competing at the Whalen's World's Invitational at the L.A. Elks in '69 or '70, which was of course straight pool. Maybe Keoneyo could confirm, if he remembers. It might have been a local player I'm thinking of.

Anyway, he looked like a pimp in a prayer meeting. Real nervous and uncomfortable. I don't think he could ever fade tournament play, at least in more modern times.

~Doc

wincardona · Sep 12, 2014

Ross Keith Thompson said:
Johnston city 1970 I played Ronnie in the all around. Before our final match for the championship I sat and watched as Lassiter and Ronnie Played 11 of 21 in their match for the chance to play me in the final match. Ronnie won first break and hit Lassiter with 3 racks I believe. From that point on they both swapped 2 or 3 racks a piece until Ronnie pulled the match out late with 2 racks I believe. The point is that Ronnie could play any body in the world 9 ball or 14 and 1 with any body, he just didn't care for these games like he did one pocket which he was the master in his prime no doubt about it. He would have won some and lost some to the top 9 ball players in his time even though he refused to knock heads with them, He could have beaten Myself on any given day, or Cole Dickson, Rempe, Kelly, Cardona, Billy Johnson, Hall and so on. Most of these guys would have been the favorite to beat him but who could make a living playing any of these guys even nine ball every day. The answer is no body! (LAUGHING) Ronnie could run a hundred balls or 5 racks of 9 ball but he would rather give you a ball playing one pocket! He did shark people and pop off while they were shooting and that was classless of him. He popped off to me in our final match in Johnston City until the end. I miss Ronnie and forgive him for what he did. I will always remember him as one of the greatest players ever, no matter the game he could play it with the best us.

You're correct Keith when you say that Ronnie could play all games well, especially 9ball. Ronnie was regarded as an excellent 9ball player when he was playing in his prime, it took a top player like Reid, Schwartz, Kelly, Crane, and yours truly (me) to give him the "last two". I played Ronnie with the last two and beat him when I was playing my best, had I not been at my best I wouldn't of won. Ed Kelly would play Ronnie the "all around" one pocket..straight pool..9ball. It was a close match and they played it many times gambling against one another. Based off of that should give you a clearer understanding on the "all around"prowess that Ronnie had playing all games. He, Ronnie also played Mizerak 100 to 75 straight pool, getting 25 balls to 100. That game was also a close game, I watched them play many times during the Stardust days in Vegas, what a great tournament that was.

Ronnie was regarded as the best one handed one pocket player of his time, along with Eddie Taylor. Ronnie beat players like Jimmy Reid getting 8/6 playing one handed to Jimmy's two. He also beat Cole Dickson the same way. I beat Ronnie the only time we played that way, but it wasn't easy. It was a race to five and the score was four apiece and Ronnie was shooting his match ball from the center of the table and miscued. I ran out to win the match. Of course Reid, Dickson, and myself weren't regarded as top one pocket players at that time, but none the less we had great fire power, especially when we played some one who only had "one hand".:lol

If he could of beaten Artie one handed I really don't know, Larry Schwartz would be some one that could answer that question, him being close to both Artie and Ronnie.

Any ways, Ronnie (may he rest in peace) was truly a great all around player.

Bill Incardona

NH Steve · Sep 12, 2014

mr3cushion said:
In that same thread about Ronnie, I read this morning a guy pt109 posted this.

Ronnie ALLEN

Ronnie didn't like 9-ball....but I know of a 7- pack he ran for serious cash.

If someone played Ronnie an all-round of Ronnie's seven best games when he played
his best, I can't think of anyone who could have beaten him.

Little known fact....Ronnie may have been the best one-handed 3-cushion player that ever lived.

I spit my OJ all over my shirt when I read this statement!

The ONLY games "RA" could have beaten Artie at, "one-handed" were, 9 ball and golf on the snooker table, until Artie figured out the game! :sorry

In the one-handed 3C, Ronnie could have gotten 2 to 1 on the money, and robbed! :lol:lol:lol

"Aguzate" was a very well regarded one handed player, and I know he also played billiards. Did you guys ever bump into each other? I think he may have gone back to Puerto Rico before you came into your own as a player however. Little known fact, he is still living!

mr3cushion · Sep 12, 2014

NH Steve said:
"Aguzate" was a very well regarded one handed player, and I know he also played billiards. Did you guys ever bump into each other? I think he may have gone back to Puerto Rico before you came into your own as a player however. Little known fact, he is still living!

Steve, Artie robbed, "Aguzate" playing 8 ball and one pocket one-handed! Along with, Sergio, (beat him for 18,000.00 playing 8ball). Miami, (one pocket) Mike Massey, (beat him for the winners check, $5,000.00, he won in BIG 9 ball tourney in Chicago and again in Milwaukee) and David Howard playing 8 ball!

And NO ONE could EVER beat Artie playing, one-handed 3 cushion, NO ONE! The truth be known, fi Ronnie shot two-handed 3C and Artie one-handed, he couldn't win that way either!

NO ONE ever beat Artie playing, anything one-handed!

BTW, Aguzate and Sergio were regarded as the BEST one-handed players back then in the World!

It's hard to bet against a guy that NEVER lost playing one-handed!

keoneyo · Sep 12, 2014

gulfportdoc said:
I could be mistaken, but it seems to me that they talked RA into competing at the Whalen's World's Invitational at the L.A. Elks in '69 or '70, which was of course straight pool. Maybe Keoneyo could confirm, if he remembers. It might have been a local player I'm thinking of.

Anyway, he looked like a pimp in a prayer meeting. Real nervous and uncomfortable. I don't think he could ever fade tournament play, at least in more modern times.

~Doc

Yes I remember RA there. I even have a copy of the program somewhere with his pic in it. I heard the one time Irving Crane gambled he got into a game with RA. Ronnie came up with a ridiculous prop that the Deacon had to call his next shot before pocketing the ball he shot at in 14.1. It was just too appealing for Crane, who was not a gambler at all, to pass up.
Needless to say Ronnie chucked that all up after Irv beat him and went back to the drawing board. But it had to be someone like RA to get Crane to bet something.

gulfportdoc · Sep 12, 2014

keoneyo said:
Yes I remember RA there. I even have a copy of the program somewhere with his pic in it. I heard the one time Irving Crane gambled he got into a game with RA. Ronnie came up with a ridiculous prop that the Deacon had to call his next shot before pocketing the ball he shot at in 14.1. It was just too appealing for Crane, who was not a gambler at all, to pass up.
Needless to say Ronnie chucked that all up after Irv beat him and went back to the drawing board. But it had to be someone like RA to get Crane to bet something.

Thanks for the confirmation. Remember some of those wild ring games they'd play in the bar during the Elk's tournaments? One year they were playing a 7 ball ring game at $50 a man, which was big money at the time. It was fast action, with the booze and pills flowing...

Can't imagine RA giving Crane that prop bet. His mixture must have been wrong.

Crane could put the cueball inside a 3" circle on every shot.

RA was something to watch, though...

~Doc

My ONE time gambling with Ronnie Allen

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