Poolrooms: What Are They To You?

Are they the "church of the good hustler", as "Fast Eddie" said in the Hustler?

Or are they more like a morgue as his backer Charlie said? Are the tables the slabs they lay the stiffs on?

Or is being in a poolroom "cool and dark, like swimming underwater", as Jesse Cardiff said in "A Game Of Pool".

Or is it something else entirely to you? What do you think?

Cowboy Dennis said:

Are they the "church of the good hustler", as "Fast Eddie" said in the Hustler?

Or are they more like a morgue as his backer Charlie said? Are the tables the slabs they lay the stiffs on?

Or is being in a poolroom "cool and dark, like swimming underwater", as Jesse Cardiff said in "A Game Of Pool".

Or is it something else entirely to you? What do you think?

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A pool room is were I made My Living.

"They're Gone but Not Forgotton"

"They're Gone but Not Forgotton"

The "Pool Rooms" of my era are gone, I just turned 64 in June, 45 yrs ago if you were lucky enough to live in a major city like New York, Chicago, LA, Detroit, or San Francisco, you would have seen what I consider to be REAL POOL ROOMS. When you walked thru the doors, imediately you could feel the atmosphere, smoke filled, yes, probably dark, maybe, but they all had the same personality, a concoction of buisiness men, hustlers, pimps, bookies, Celebs, this is a hard cocktail to sell. You throw all theses different elements into one shaker and you have to come out with something that leaves a good taste in your mouth, it's not easy. What made it work was the way the establishments treated you as a valued customer. You walk in, Sir, can I take coat?, do you need your cue?, can I get a set of balls for you?, can I get you something to drink. This made you want to be in those maybe not so attractive places. I think players and non players back then were more serious about the game, I can rememeber see and including myself people playing and practicing for hours, not just banging balls, but with a purpose to thier practice. After about 10 yrs of hangout in such a place, I thought, every young man out of high school should 1yr in a real pool room, they would get more of a education that will help them in REAL life than 4 yrs of colloge right out of the gate. But today, most "billiard rooms", are soda pop joints, alot of flash, and no substance. If you were the best player in a room back in the day, you were a real player, you had to be to surrvive. And I think my generation was 25 yrs to late for when these rooms were really booming. If I could only go back!

That 'era'

That 'era'

mr3cushion said:

The "Pool Rooms" of my era are gone

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Yes they are. And it is doubtful they will ever return. The sense of caring and customer service is gone and has been replaced by those uninitiated house persons with either the 'when I get around to it' attitude, or the 'I am a bartender and do not know squat about a pool room' aire. It goes down hill from there in many respects. And even Atlanta seems to have no pool room of repute .... I would kill for a Cochran's or Palace Billiards. On the bright side however (least it be said I have a negative attitude) I will say that the South is very nice: in California I had to drive 63 miles either south, northwest, or 90 miles east to get to a pocket billiard emporium whereas now I can drive 63 miles in any direction and pass within 5 miles of 8 or so fairly nice emporia.

Who wrote this?:

"And then, in the afternoon, when the players began to come in earnest, and the tobacco smoke and the sounds of hard, glossy balls hitting one another and the squeaking sound of chalk squares pressed against hard leather cue tips would begin, then would start the final metamorphosis ascending to the full only when, late at night, the casual players and drunks would all be gone, leaving only the intent men and the furtive, who watched and bet, while certain others—a small, assorted coterie of men, both drably dressed, who all knew one another but seldom spoke—played quiet games of intense and brilliant pool on the tables in the back of the room. At such times this poolroom, Bennington’s, would be alive in a distinct way."

demonrho said:

Who wrote this?:

"And then, in the afternoon, when the players began to come in earnest, and the tobacco smoke and the sounds of hard, glossy balls hitting one another and the squeaking sound of chalk squares pressed against hard leather cue tips would begin, then would start the final metamorphosis ascending to the full only when, late at night, the casual players and drunks would all be gone, leaving only the intent men and the furtive, who watched and bet, while certain others—a small, assorted coterie of men, both drably dressed, who all knew one another but seldom spoke—played quiet games of intense and brilliant pool on the tables in the back of the room. At such times this poolroom, Bennington’s, would be alive in a distinct way."

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It sounds like Walter Tevis to me, but I've been wrong before.

I too yearn for the old time rooms: McGann's and Henniger's in Pittsburgh, Ames and McGirr's in NY, Cochran's and the Palace in SF. But "players" rooms are not likely to ever emerge during pool's current popular phase.

Ironically, I think if pool LOSES popularity, the old style rooms (or something like them) have a chance to re-emerge. Since most poolrooms today are largely fluff, they naturally attract a customer base whose main interests do not include pool (or the reverse). We're faced with establishments which are basically loud Rap emporiums full of testosterone/estrogen posturing, amply feuled by booze. Apparently pool tables are there simply to facilitate all the nonsense.

It's possible that when pool's popularity wanes --at least for the "in" crowd-- we'll see some rooms establish themselves whose main purpose will be playing cuesports games. Maybe then we'll have a return of the poolroom atmoshpere that many of us miss.

Doc

Not Ames

Not Ames

demonrho said:

Who wrote this?:

"And then, in the afternoon, when the players began to come in earnest, and the tobacco smoke and the sounds of hard, glossy balls hitting one another and the squeaking sound of chalk squares pressed against hard leather cue tips would begin, then would start the final metamorphosis ascending to the full only when, late at night, the casual players and drunks would all be gone, leaving only the intent men and the furtive, who watched and bet, while certain others—a small, assorted coterie of men, both drably dressed, who all knew one another but seldom spoke—played quiet games of intense and brilliant pool on the tables in the back of the room. At such times this poolroom, Bennington’s, would be alive in a distinct way."

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Walter Tevis was certainly referring to Bensingers when he changed the name to Bennington's. Ames and New York were no place in his mind.

the Beard

fred bentivegna said:

Walter Tevis was certainly referring to Bensingers when he changed the name to Bennington's. Ames and New York were no place in his mind.

the Beard

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You're right, Freddy, because a few paragraphs before, he writes:

"A poolroom in the morning is a strange place…for this was the top floor of an ancient and venerable building which, squat and ugly, sat in eight-story insignificance in downtown Chicago."

Pool is what WE make of it. It always has been and always will be what WE make of it

Pool is what WE make of it. It always has been and always will be what WE make of it

Cowboy Dennis said:

Are they the "church of the good hustler", as "Fast Eddie" said in the Hustler?

Or are they more like a morgue as his backer Charlie said? Are the tables the slabs they lay the stiffs on?

Or is being in a poolroom "cool and dark, like swimming underwater", as Jesse Cardiff said in "A Game Of Pool".

Or is it something else entirely to you? What do you think?

Click to expand...

It troubles me to see all these stories of how great pool used to be. While I wasn't there and I do believe pool held a different place in peoples' lives, there is no going back.

Pool is what WE make it today and tomorrow. Fortunately, we have a number of colorful personalities to keep the past in perspectives. No two perspectives will ever be the same (that adds the color!).

I see a lot in pool today that will become the colorful past in years to come.

SVB, Scott Frost, Jasmine O., and many others are all examples of people that will write chapters in the history of pool.

Funny thing about the past... it always seems nicer than it really was.

There are still some legendary rooms in the country. Chris' in Chicago is still about as hard-core as it gets (love that room). Hard Times in Sacramento has a serious tourney room. Bellflower is in the same league.

Kolby's in Phoenix attracts a very tough field for open 9-ball. Amsterdam Billiards in NYC is worthy although I preferred the location upstairs before they moved.

Comet Billiards in North Jersey is a serious room and worth visiting if you are in the tri-state area. Golden Cue in Albany, NY was hard core. I have not visited since the remodel.

JOB in Nashville is a serious room. The Spot in NE PA is also worth of a visit if you're in the Philly area.

Side Pockets in KC is a decent room. Chatanooga Billiard Club is a really nice place. Atlantic City Billiards is also a serious room.

I think pool (like most things in life) is dynamic and it ebbs and flows. I prefer to look at things today as "half full". Maybe the glass was full or overflowing at some time in the past, but at least there's still water in the glass today.

Steve (looks at rooms like people - if you listen, watch carefully, and engage selectively - you should learn something.)

I doubt that we'll ever see the old pool room culture again if for no other reason than the rents, utilities, etc. are so high now, the rooms couldn't make it on pool alone.

One of the main things I miss is the 24 hour room. I haven't seen one of those is ages.

Skin

In addition to being a place where I can relax and be myself, the pool room is the perfect place to observe the male species in it's natural habitat
XOXO
Fanny

Fanatic said:

In addition to being a place where I can relax and be myself, the pool room is the perfect place to observe the male species in it's natural habitat
XOXO
Fanny

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In addition to being a place where I can relax and be myself, the pool room is the perfect place to observe the female species, in the male species natural habitat.
XOXO
Dick <---prefers the female species to the hairy legged, often un-washed male species.

SJDinPHX said:

In addition to being a place where I can relax and be myself, the pool room is the perfect place to observe the female species, in the male species natural habitat.XOXODick

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It's not as fun Dick all you'll see is a lot of eye rolling ( )
XOXO

Exciting,mystique

Exciting,mystique

Yes the older rooms will never be replaced, in terms of action, excitement, and the mystique that modern day rooms fail to offer. Mostly all the older rooms were either located on the second floor, or in the basement, and as you made that long walk up, or down the stairs, that's when your imagination excited you. The long walk into these rooms alone were worth waking up for.

wincardona said:

Yes the older rooms will never be replaced, in terms of action, excitement, and the mystique that modern day rooms fail to offer. Mostly all the older rooms were either located on the second floor, or in the basement, and as you made that long walk up, or down the stairs, that's when your imagination excited you. The long walk into these rooms alone were worth waking up for.

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Well said Billy.

When I walked up the stairs into Cochran's, or the Le Cue, or Down the stairs into the Guy's and Doll's, The feeling must have been something like Dillinger felt, when he entered a bank.
Of course there were also times when I left, feeling like I'd been shot at and missed,....shit at and hit.

SJDinPHX said:

Well said Billy.

When I walked up the stairs into Cochran's, or the Le Cue, or Down the stairs into the Guy's and Doll's, The feeling must have been something like Dillinger felt, when he entered a bank.
Of course there were also times when I left, feeling like I'd been shot at and missed,....shit at and hit.

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Thier are lots of pool rooms But the real pool room enviorment left with the old pool rooms and all the old sweathers. Thier is more money today then years ago. But the betting and action realy droped. And if it wasant for the tournements pool would be way down. And you might not have 20 women playing. And the bigest thing that is keeping pool alive is the bar tournements and bar tables. Pool could be real big because its year around . But you have to get TV involved. And the need to start paying the players. If some one could figure out how to get a couple thousand people to watch the games that would be a big start. The olden days are gone. And we were part of it and all we have left is the memories. And What a great feeling it was to realy play good. And realy enjoy the game. Wating for another day. So we can do it all over again. Just remember the thrill we use to get practicing and hitting shots. And then finaly we could execuite the shot we couldnt make. After shooting thousands of shoots over and over. Tell we could do it and our reward was self satisfaction. Yes the sun will come up tomarrow and the sun will come up when we are gone and the rain bow will shine over our grave.

Poolrooms: bastions of batchelors?

Poolrooms: bastions of batchelors?

Ned Polsky in his 1960’s era book “Hustlers, Beats, and Others” writes:
“As we have observed, the various alleged “causes” for the decay of the America poolroom have had a minor role at best. The genuine prime cause seems never to have been mentioned: poolrooms were the exact center and veritable stronghold of a special kind of subculture that has become increasingly rare and unimportant in America—the heterosexual but all-male subculture, which required that certain gathering places (clubs, barber shops, taverns) serve as sacrosanct refuges from women. The poolroom was not just one of these places: it was the one, the keystone.”
http://talk.cuetable.com/showthread.php?t=5584

demonrho said:

Ned Polsky in his 1960’s era book “Hustlers, Beats, and Others” writes:
“As we have observed, the various alleged “causes” for the decay of the America poolroom have had a minor role at best. The genuine prime cause seems never to have been mentioned: poolrooms were the exact center and veritable stronghold of a special kind of subculture that has become increasingly rare and unimportant in America—the heterosexual but all-male subculture, which required that certain gathering places (clubs, barber shops, taverns) serve as sacrosanct refuges from women. The poolroom was not just one of these places: it was the one, the keystone.”
http://talk.cuetable.com/showthread.php?t=5584

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That's a keen observation. The art of manliness has been lost in the sissy 21st century. There are certain sounds, for example, that speak manliness. The click of pool balls in the quiet of a pool room is one. Among the others are:

The pop of an old fashioned tin (not an aluminum pop top!) beer can being opened and an empty being crushed by hand
The crack of a WOOD bat
The thud of a left hook landing to the liver
The moan of a woman being pleasured
The sizzle of a steak on the grill
The roar of a fast car
The scraping of a straight razor against whisker stubble
The whir of cards being shuffled correctly

What the heck do metrosexuals and women who can't do one stinking pull-up know about any of that?!

Until true manliness comes back into style, real pool halls probably will remain a thing of the past.

Good post, demonrho.

Skin

skin i think you found a new avatar