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  #101  
Old 10-16-2014, 10:11 AM
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mr3cushion mr3cushion is offline
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Looks like I'm going to have to dust off my science book before I login everyday!
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  #102  
Old 10-16-2014, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petie View Post
...though the cue ball is only legally struck once during a shot, it is in contact over a segment of time.
1-2 milliseconds (thousandths of a second), depending on tip offset from center, hardness and stroke speed.

There's pretty much nothing you can do with your stroke to change the contact time, because the soft flesh of the grip hand gives on impact, "decoupling" your hand/arm from the cue during the contact time. This means, for instance, that "accelerating through the ball" doesn't do anything to the ball (though it might help keep your stroke straight and give better speed control).

pj
chgo
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  #103  
Old 10-16-2014, 07:36 PM
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gulfportdoc gulfportdoc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
1-2 milliseconds (thousandths of a second), depending on tip offset from center, hardness and stroke speed.

There's pretty much nothing you can do with your stroke to change the contact time, because the soft flesh of the grip hand gives on impact, "decoupling" your hand/arm from the cue during the contact time. This means, for instance, that "accelerating through the ball" doesn't do anything to the ball (though it might help keep your stroke straight and give better speed control).

pj
chgo
This is why "swipe" or "drag" is not possible, unless the CB were trapped between cue tip and cushion, which would be illegal (and pretty useless). There's nothing wrong with using a swiping motion of the cue tip, but the tip is not staying on the CB any longer than it does in a normal forward stroke. I tried it this afternoon many times. Couldn't do it.

This may fall under your description of guys doing something for a certain result, but not actually knowing why they're getting that result (paraphrase).

~Doc
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  #104  
Old 10-16-2014, 08:33 PM
straightback straightback is offline
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My SINGULAR point here is that there is a 4th variable, which is the angle at which the cue ball is struck on the horizontal axis. You cannoy say that, all things being equal, all hits on a CB at the same spot are the same. You have backhand english and parallel english and so on.

Last edited by straightback; 10-16-2014 at 09:14 PM.
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  #105  
Old 10-16-2014, 10:35 PM
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Patrick Johnson Patrick Johnson is offline
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Originally Posted by straightback View Post
My SINGULAR point here is that there is a 4th variable, which is the angle at which the cue ball is struck on the horizontal axis. You cannoy say that, all things being equal, all hits on a CB at the same spot are the same. You have backhand english and parallel english and so on.
All hits on a CB at the same spot that make the CB hit the same target are the same - they have the same spot and angle (and probably speed) or they won't make the shot. The test I described a few posts back shows it.

Backhand and parallel English are just different methods to get to the same cue angle to compensate for squirt (don't let the misnomer "parallel" fool you) - if they didn't get to the same cue angle the shot wouldn't go.

The general principle is that there's only one spot-angle-speed that will give the CB the same spin-direction-speed.

pj
chgo

Last edited by Patrick Johnson; 10-16-2014 at 10:54 PM.
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  #106  
Old 10-16-2014, 10:43 PM
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Patrick Johnson Patrick Johnson is offline
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Originally Posted by gulfportdoc View Post
This is why "swipe" or "drag" is not possible, unless the CB were trapped between cue tip and cushion, which would be illegal (and pretty useless).
It's pretty useful for the old CB/OB Frozen Perpendicular to the Rail Push Stroke Spinning the OB Sideways Into the Nearby Corner Pocket shot. Which I think might be a felony.

pj
chgo
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  #107  
Old 10-17-2014, 04:35 PM
petie petie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
1-2 milliseconds (thousandths of a second), depending on tip offset from center, hardness and stroke speed.

There's pretty much nothing you can do with your stroke to change the contact time, because the soft flesh of the grip hand gives on impact, "decoupling" your hand/arm from the cue during the contact time. This means, for instance, that "accelerating through the ball" doesn't do anything to the ball (though it might help keep your stroke straight and give better speed control).

pj
chgo
With some well delivered strokes the cue is in free flight at the time of contact.
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  #108  
Old 10-17-2014, 06:09 PM
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With some well delivered strokes the cue is in free flight at the time of contact.
I like to imagine that I'm throwing a spear underhand.

pj
chgo
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  #109  
Old 10-17-2014, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
It's pretty useful for the old CB/OB Frozen Perpendicular to the Rail Push Stroke Spinning the OB Sideways Into the Nearby Corner Pocket shot. Which I think might be a felony.

pj
chgo
Ha! One of the first trick shots I ever saw: Nick's Pool Room and Hat Cleaning Shop, Dormont, PA, 1959.

~Doc
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  #110  
Old 10-23-2014, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by straightback View Post
To conclude, I use differing strokes and grips because they allow me to get to the proper angle, speed and spin. In this way, they are correlated with the results I want, but they do not CAUSE them.

Next time I'm in court I'll try that defense.

"Well sure your Honor I rested the gun on a solid rest, took v-e-r-r-r-r-y careful aim, and gently pulled the trigger straight back. But that's not what killed him, it was the bullet what killed him."

Sorry SB, just saw this and I couldn't help myself.
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