Shark moves

Cowboy Dennis · Jan 18, 2009

Violent imagery

Violent imagery

junior said:
Hmm, that's some awfully violent imagery there . I know what you mean though. Still, I wonder who gets more action in the long run: the guy who behaves himself or the shark? I can definitely see how too much sharking can cost you customers. And it probably doesn't help your own game much either. On the other hand, a little sharking might get under people's skin enough to make them want to beat you even when they've got the worst of it. So, morality and honor aside (and since when are pool hustlers overly scrupulous about those?), which kind of behavior will make you more money in the long run? If you are playing for pride, then obviously you want to test yourself against the toughest opponents possible while behaving in a sportsmanlike way. But if your priority is making a living, things might be different. I'd like to know what others think.....

If you do not want to rip the other guys heart out then you should not be playing for cash. And if you get him down and do not put your foot on his throat, then you should not be playing for cash. It's not that you want to hurt the guy, any way except financially. But you do need to want to kill him, financially. We all have violent thoughts. Financially.

Cowboy Dennis · Jan 18, 2009

Inhaling or Exhaling

Inhaling or Exhaling

Skin said:
One of the better shark moves I've seen is asking the other guy if he inhales or exhales when he pulls the trigger.

Skin

If you had asked that of me or anyone else that had read W.Timothy Galweys book: The Inner Game of Tennis, we would have simply answered your question and moved on to the next shot. Good move on newbies though.

onepocket926 · Jul 17, 2011

...Bravo....

...Bravo....

fred bentivegna said:
That's the critical point of the argument. When you played me you might as well expect anything. I was a serious advocate of gamesmanship. I learned it's power at an early age, when it was used regularly against me and kept me broke. I was very subtle however, and seldom got caught. I could do a little work in even in the tough joints. Why do you think Ronnie was so hard to beat? We even came to an understanding once, and he bestowed me the honor of not sharking me if I would not shark him. Maybe the only time in his life where he suspended operations. I often thought of doing a course in gamesmanship, something like that movie, "School for Scoundrels."

When you are not blessed with natural talent, you have to develop other skills.

Gamesmanship, how powerful it can be. I was playing in Monroe Brock's big tournament in Richmond, KY at the Maverick Club. Keith McCready was my opponent and we were playing 6 out of 11 short rack 9 ball banks.

The score was 5 games for Keith to my zero when I broke the balls and didn't make anything. Keith banked 4 and missed a tough bank for the session ball and left me hanging in the corner pocket at the foot of the table with no shot.

Responding criminally to a hopeless situation, I took a ball out of the ball return and put it on the spot, giving myself a cross-side. Keith, thinking HE must have broke the balls and made one, didn't bat an eye. I banked 3 from there, played safe, and wound up winning that game and the next five to take the session!

After counting the balls that were left, Keith knew something was wrong, but couldn't put his finger on it. I cooled him out by arguing that no matter what, he still needed 1 ball, thats the one thing we were both in agreement about. He also agreed that I banked 3, so what was it we were arguing about?

There were sweators in the bleachers that knew what had happened, and they were writhing in their seats trying to mentally tip Keith off. Gamesmanship was my compensation for my weak shot-making skills.
Did I feel guilty? Nah.

the Beard

....if that one is in your book....where can I order one?.....I'm sure that's the only way...I'd ever beat Keith....maybe we have more in common than I thought.....

RedCard · Jul 17, 2011

Sharko

Sharko

Back in '68 or'69 a buddy of mine was playing a pretty good player who also happened to be AWOL from the army at the time. They were playing late night in a basement poolroom in a grand old hotel. One of my friend's backers had a national reputation as a card/dice mechanic and slot cheat. He did several things along those lines very well and had also killed some deserving folks. I later ran into people in different parts of the country who backed that up. None of them spoke ill of him.

One of the nine-ball sessions was tied late going to eleven. Joe Tripp (one of the names the slot/cards/dice/gun/con guy used on the road) had one of his friends sneak out and loudly rattle the doors at the poolroom's private entrance. Joe went up the marble stairs to see what the noise was and came down and informed everyone there were some MPs at the door. I was living on the fifth floor of the hotel at the time (I was aware of the shark in progress) and he asked me if I'd take the player upstairs until they got rid of the MPs. I put him on a little known freight elevator in the basement and took him upstairs to safety. A couple of minutes later the call came that the coast was clear. Back to the freight elevator and down to the poolroom.

The game resumed and the badly shaken player couldn't make a ball. His stroke, so smooth and effective minutes before, was gone. He punched around until his bankroll was too. He didn't win a set after his elevator ride.

bstroud · Jul 17, 2011

When I was a young player in Dallas I spent a lot of time in the Black pool room on Forest Avenue. Everyone in the room gambled.

One day I am paying a guy 9 ball and am betting just about everyone in the pool room.

The 9 ball is on the spot and I have a shot at the opposite end at the eight ball. Just as I lean over to make the eight someone in the crowd at that end of the table says something about me being a White boy.

I back off the shot, get back down and make the eight ball with position on the spot. Problem was that the 9 ball was now in the middle of the back rail. I don't have a cut and everyone is mum.

Instead of having a argument I just end rail banked the nine and everyone broke up. Pool was fun in those days.

Bill Stroud

wincardona · Jul 17, 2011

bstroud said:
When I was a young player in Dallas I spent a lot of time in the Black pool room on Forest Avenue. Everyone in the room gambled.

One day I am paying a guy 9 ball and am betting just about everyone in the pool room.

The 9 ball is on the spot and I have a shot at the opposite end at the eight ball. Just as I lean over to make the eight someone in the crowd at that end of the table says something about me being a White boy.

I back off the shot, get back down and make the eight ball with position on the spot. Problem was that the 9 ball was now in the middle of the back rail. I don't have a cut and everyone is mum.

Instead of having a argument I just end rail banked the nine and everyone broke up. Pool was fun in those days.

Bill Stroud

Curious to know where the 9 ball ended up the next game?

Billy I.

lll · Jul 17, 2011

bstroud said:
When I was a young player in Dallas I spent a lot of time in the Black pool room on Forest Avenue. Everyone in the room gambled.

One day I am paying a guy 9 ball and am betting just about everyone in the pool room.

The 9 ball is on the spot and I have a shot at the opposite end at the eight ball. Just as I lean over to make the eight someone in the crowd at that end of the table says something about me being a White boy.

I back off the shot, get back down and make the eight ball with position on the spot. Problem was that the 9 ball was now in the middle of the back rail. I don't have a cut and everyone is mum.

Instead of having a argument I just end rail banked the nine and everyone broke up. Pool was fun in those days.

Bill Stroud

mr. stroud
if you did that which i beleive you did
your shot in the end game thread is the right one for you

Mkbtank · Apr 11, 2018

Shark moves

Reviving this golden oldie thread heh.

I heard a classic yesterday perpetrated by a real slime in my city. My buddy is playing slimey about 20 years ago for good money and scratches. There are balls uptable behind the line. Slime is standing uptable with his hand on the felt as if to catch the cue ball (which my buddy was now retrieving from the ball return). Buddy rolls the pill uptable to Slimey whereupon he (slimey) lifts his hand off the table and the cue ball now hits multiple balls which were uptable. Slimey now proceeds to call a second foul on my buddy claiming he had just been leaning on the table and was never going to catch the cue ball. Not sure if he got away with it or not but I do know they have never played since that day all those years ago and there is still bad blood, at least on my buddy’s side.

Billy Jackets · Apr 12, 2018

I played a guy that I now realise was probably on meth, but I thought he was trying to shark me .
He was twitchin and itchin and jumping all over the place and stroking his cue like a 13 year old boy after a date with Darla.
I finally said something to him, and he told me, that me saying he was sharking me, was a shark itself?
How do you proceed after that statement?

El Chapo · Apr 12, 2018

Nobody has to be sharked at all nowadays for players to whine for hours and act like they are being sharked. The entire crap with the racking. I am not saying many don't have legit gripes but I firmly believe pool is currently a sport where if you play good you simply just must be putting some kind of move on the other guy whether it is the rack or some other bs.

They have a wave pool in surfing now, like a legit one where the wave is good and the competitions are going to be "who can ride the EXACT same wave better". Which I find very interesting. It is more of a true competition... maybe not as exciting, but more of a test of skill.

No problem to do this in one hole. Make a new form of one hole where nobody ever breaks. The first layout is somehow predetermined. Now, you use that same exact layout for the next game but the other player gets the first shot (so order got reversed). That would be a cool way to sort of take the break completely out of it, which seems to be one of the main gripes with one pocket when it comes to the fairness of the test.

El Chapo · Apr 12, 2018

What did Cowboy Dennis do anyway? I always miss all the good stuff.

NH Steve · Apr 12, 2018

El Chapo said:
What did Cowboy Dennis do anyway? I always miss all the good stuff.

He was actually a very loyal supporter of onepocket.org -- but he could sure get extremely blunt and he did not care where the chips were going to fly. Sometimes people force the question of "who is going to stay and who is going to go". I am always going to be extra protective of our actual player legends here or HOF inductees here -- they earn that in my opinion. My apologies to any of you who think otherwise.

unoperro · Apr 12, 2018

El Chapo said:
Nobody has to be sharked at all nowadays for players to whine for hours and act like they are being sharked. The entire crap with the racking. I am not saying many don't have legit gripes but I firmly believe pool is currently a sport where if you play good you simply just must be putting some kind of move on the other guy whether it is the rack or some other bs.

They have a wave pool in surfing now, like a legit one where the wave is good and the competitions are going to be "who can ride the EXACT same wave better". Which I find very interesting. It is more of a true competition... maybe not as exciting, but more of a test of skill.

No problem to do this in one hole. Make a new form of one hole where nobody ever breaks. The first layout is somehow predetermined. Now, you use that same exact layout for the next game but the other player gets the first shot (so order got reversed). That would be a cool way to sort of take the break completely out of it, which seems to be one of the main gripes with one pocket when it comes to the fairness of the test.

Position of the balls can still be "massaged". Still be argueing.

Billy Jackets · Apr 12, 2018

I just remembered this one, and thought it was worth a mention.
I'm in a bar poolroom where almost everyone plays for something , many of them 100 a game or more.
They are all my speed or within a ball except for 2 younger guys with limited funds, and the owner, who plays better than everyone.
They are all out to be the first to beat him and don't mind that it's costing them a lot of money.
He's a really sharp guy, and has been to the rodeo many times, and knows about all the angles at pool.
After a year or so of all wins , One day one of his daily customers has him dead.
He makes the next to the last ball and is straight in from a foot away and I hear , that's good!.
The kid rakes the balls in and the owner say's," what are you doing" , and he says ,"you said it's good. "
The owner says
" I didn't say anything!!!! "and several guys back him up.
To this day I believe he had schooled one of his minions for just such an event.
Once someone beats the giant , there's nothing left to prove, and this guy was smart enough to never let the cash cow die, without doing everything known to man.

Dennis "Whitey" Young · Apr 13, 2018

In around '72 I am at the Bellflower Palace banging balls around on the front table, and the place is pretty empty. A guy comes up and asks me to play banks. Banks is not a game you usually get asked to play, I said; "sure", I was 21 and been playing about 3 years.

I did not get his name but his side kick "Cigar Jim" was with him! We probably played 5hrs or more and ended up dead even. So we played one more game for all the doe, and I had him, I am on my 8th ball and its 3" from the side pocket and off the rail, and my cb is positioned just right to bank it straight across side, and then this guy comes up; "hey pally how you doing", lays his head down on the table and blows cigar smoke in my eyes, as I am down on the shot! Well it threw me off and I miss the simplest of banks! Then the guy ran 4 and out.

Shortly afterwards as I am still in a daze as to what happened, a sweater came up and said; "you just played the best bank pool player in so. cal.". I did not say anything, just disgusted! Today looking back at it, I should of kicked Cigar Jim's ass, but I did not have that kind of demeanor, wish I did!

That guy would not play me again on a well banking table, for he wanted to get me on softer rails, which would be disastrous for me, for that is the difference between a ball rattling and going in the hole. But for him on soft rails he had a technique of firing the balls hard and burying them deep into the cushion, and then he really shined!

The best bank player I knew of was Fugi, he is a phillipino. We always battled and battled playing even, but he would just edge ahead. Those are great memories for me now. He showed me a bank shot once, and I could never duplicate for it had such finesse and speed to get out of the kiss. Last time I heard of him was in around 2008 he was taking Efren to the cleaners in the green room at the US Open playing some funky game. That sounds like Fugi, for he knows the hustle and how to match up. Whitey

Jeff sparks · Apr 14, 2018

Playing either Jersey Red or Ronnie Allen was indeed the most troubling when it came to fading getting sharked... They were both masters at it...

Red’s best move was so subtle that if you were just sweating the game you might not even notice it, but if you were playing him, he’d stand within your peripheral vision and would time your stroke perfectly with a slight lean forward, or a move of his hand that was holding his cue stick, or a word to a sweater standing a few feet away... He had perfect timing too, Red was a gifted athlete, he knew how to distract his opponent, and if what he was doing wasn’t working, he would find out what would...

Ronnie was a master at body movements also, but his best shark moves involved his mouth... He’d never shut up... If you didn’t insist on playing mum pool with Ronnie, you’d better get a couple of extra balls thrown into the spot, and that might not be enough... He was as strong as they came in the shark department...

As Freddie eluded to in an earlier post, it was part of the old school players arsenal, if you didn’t do it, you were giving up weight...

A quick story....
Red and Danny Jones used partner up and bet 3 team parlays with the bookies in town... They would always hash out their picks up at LeCue in the morning until they finally agreed on the 3 teams they would put in the parlay... well one day they quickly agreed on two teams, but had bitter differences about the third pick... one liked Frisco, the other liked LA... Red finally said, ok we can’t agree so let’s play a game of one pocket to see who’s pick is the third team in the parlay... Danny says, Ok, but you gotta spot me the break... Red quickly agrees then asks Danny... Mild Sharking, or Heavy?

LSJohn · Apr 14, 2018

Jeff sparks said:
Mild Sharking, or Heavy?

Reminds me of a golf buddy of mine. At the beginning of a match he'd often ask "Medium cheating?"

darmoose · Apr 14, 2018

El Chapo said:
Nobody has to be sharked at all nowadays for players to whine for hours and act like they are being sharked. The entire crap with the racking. I am not saying many don't have legit gripes but I firmly believe pool is currently a sport where if you play good you simply just must be putting some kind of move on the other guy whether it is the rack or some other bs.

They have a wave pool in surfing now, like a legit one where the wave is good and the competitions are going to be "who can ride the EXACT same wave better". Which I find very interesting. It is more of a true competition... maybe not as exciting, but more of a test of skill.

No problem to do this in one hole. Make a new form of one hole where nobody ever breaks. The first layout is somehow predetermined. Now, you use that same exact layout for the next game but the other player gets the first shot (so order got reversed). That would be a cool way to sort of take the break completely out of it, which seems to be one of the main gripes with one pocket when it comes to the fairness of the test.

I almost never play "rack your own". Avoid this and you avoid any and all racking shinnanigans, the breaker has the right to check the rack. All the crap going on with racking, in any game, is simply rediculous and has no place in competition. When will people learn?

androd · Apr 14, 2018

darmoose said:
I almost never play "rack your own". Avoid this and you avoid any and all racking shinnanigans, the breaker has the right to check the rack. All the crap going on with racking, in any game, is simply rediculous and has no place in competition. When will people learn?

98% of time when I play my opponent racks for both of us. They jump at the chance to rack.
You can tell what I think the odds of being able to manipulate a one pocket rack
are.

Most all struggle to get a tight rack for their selves, which is what I want.
I believe you rack tight for your opponent to protect your self.

P.S. Most won't agree.

beatle · Apr 14, 2018

yea but watch how he breaks the balls. a little tilt may send him into the pocket. and of course send him on tilt with the appropriate comment to go with it.

and sometimes for those that break closer to the second ball if you find two balls that tend to make him hit the second ball first that is a plus for you.
i find the white side of a stripe on the head ball and a dark ball for the second works for some. sometimes two whites better.

Shark moves

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Administrator

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member

Verified Member