Alex v. Scott: The Good, the Bad, and the ...

I understand what you're saying , Lenny, but back when bell bottoms and plaid shirts were vogue(It went out?)you still could not wear jeans and a t-shirt to play in a tournament. Many pool rooms would not let you play wearing a t shirt if it was in a business with other sports IE, bowling, miniature golf. Scott was dressed to the "nines" if you like gansta dress. Are you saying that's all he owns? My point is, keep wearing that crap if you want tournaments to pay $3000-4000. You want the big money in pool? Not dressed like that or how they do at the DCC. As far as Richs f bombs, I covered that and it doesn't happen if you say something to Rich before hand. You're taking this too personal and you passed up all the good things.
The thing about this discussion is how to move pool forward, bigger paydays, more paid streaming, not to quibble amongst ourselves. See you soon, buddy.:lol

Scrzbill said:

I understand what you're saying , Lenny, but back when bell bottoms and plaid shirts were vogue(It went out?)you still could not wear jeans and a t-shirt to play in a tournament. Many pool rooms would not let you play wearing a t shirt if it was in a business with other sports IE, bowling, miniature golf. Scott was dressed to the "nines" if you like gansta dress. Are you saying that's all he owns? My point is, keep wearing that crap if you want tournaments to pay $3000-4000. You want the big money in pool? Not dressed like that or how they do at the DCC. As far as Richs f bombs, I covered that and it doesn't happen if you say something to Rich before hand. You're taking this too personal and you passed up all the good things.
The thing about this discussion is how to move pool forward, bigger paydays, more paid streaming, not to quibble amongst ourselves. See you soon, buddy.:lol

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I am not saying its all he owns, it was what he and Alex were comfortable wearing for an ahead set in a poolroom playing with one another, the stream was not there concern, the money was. Scott during a tournament with anything $1000 added or more is always dressed in a golf style polo with sponsors on it, black dress slacks and nice shoes.

I am not taking it personal but just find it funny instead of talking about a big money match and the play of it, we are talking about clothing choice on a late night live stream broadcast. As for Derby, they need a real dress code and enforce it, I don't care about all the hillbillys who support it, have them take there hats off during matches, where a collared shirt and slacks with shoes. On the Accu-stats stream I see guys wearing sneakers, jeans and a tee shirt, that looks really good.

Billy Jackets said:

I can't believe you used the "Members Only " jacket card.
I love that jacket!
But then, I am, "Billy Jackets"
I had a great time playing you the other night bud, thanks for the games.

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For sure bud, it was fun. I will be in there for a few hours on Sunday at around noon time so lets do it again.

Fast Lenny said:

I am not taking it personal but just find it funny instead of talking about a big money match and the play of it, we are talking about clothing choice on a late night live stream broadcast. As for Derby, they need a real dress code and enforce it, I don't care about all the hillbillys who support it, have them take there hats off during matches, where a collared shirt and slacks with shoes. On the Accu-stats stream I see guys wearing sneakers, jeans and a tee shirt, that looks really good.

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Forget about Scotts or Alexs dress, they are red herrings. Look at all the attraction that game got. 800+on the stream watching, a full house. It was a great time for some marketing. That is really what the conversation should be. I realize it was a gambling match, I didn't care about the dress, or the f bombs. To me it was a free stream that I was enjoying immensely until Tang got on(was he drunk?) Of course the buttheads that were complaining about sponsors were a drag. I asked one of them why he didn't tell the announcers no swearing that sponsors would be watching and he said it wasn't his business. You and Rich were perfect.You know enough about the game to let Rick take what you say and expand on it. Rich is the only guy I will take lessons from in California. Its ten dollars a game and he explains the game while I am donating. I love doing commentary with both of you.
It was a great match, lets do it again in Mt View, we can have four cameras and get Rich up here again. Of course theres always JR Hendy but he's a step down from us. Hardy har had

lfigueroa said:

lol, in what alternate universe is Scott dressed "in consummate high fashion" other than for those who play GTAIV or just hang out in the "hood?" I mean, really? ...

Lou Figueroa

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Seems like Lenny is the only one here with a clue. And, the only way for pool to be successfully marketed in the U.S. is like they do in poker...playing off the outlaw aspects.

To fast lenny, I really can't speak for everyone, but I think we (or at least I) was saying there is a time for nice clothes. Even though it came up in this thread, it was more about pool attire in general.

I still think there are loads of benefits to dressing nice that fly right over the head of the average player though.

But, as you say, I never shaved, and I dressed like a total scumbag when I played everyday. IF I had to do it over again, with my current "wisdom", would I do it differently. Yes... Ross just isn't that expensive. And I think it would have really helped me financially in terms of borrowing money, backers and perhaps overall attention in the poolroom and even with the ladies.

demonrho said:

Seems like Lenny is the only one here with a clue. And, the only way for pool to be successfully marketed in the U.S. is like they do in poker...playing off the outlaw aspects.

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It doesn't really matter what Lenny, or any of us think..All that matters is what the guys with the deep pockets think...and what their ad men present to them, as a viable place to spend their advertising $$$...If they are after a certain demographic, (like 15 to 25)...they may do well going with scuzzily dressed, foul mouthed, 'gangsta rapper's' !...Is that pool's demographic ? How we doin' so far ?.. Ya never know though, Goodwill clothing could suddenly become all the rage..

PS..In case you haven't noticed, Poker had a good run, but it IS fading..Maybe pool players should start wearing funny glasses, and chewing toothpicks...We already have our "Phil Helmuth"(Earl) and several "Jesus' "..

^Let's just drop the whole poker thing. The only reason it gets any coverage is because an average wanker actually DOES have a chance. It is so ridiculous. I think this is the ethos of modern day North American culture: anything that people have a chance at doing well at, without putting in any meaningful amount of time, will become successful. I don't really have a hard time with the folks who have done well with poker, I have a real hard time with the reasons why it enjoys such success in our society though. In essence, we tend to be intrigued more by chance than we do talent. Not true in every sport, but certainly true when considering poker vs pool.

Anybody who thinks SVB should be the face of American pool shows they know less about marketing than they do about pool. He's a proven, caught-on-video cheater. That's about like having a video of Tiger kicking his ball from the trees onto the fairway yet still making $40 million a year. Ain't happening.

I hope if there's a re-match that Scott & Alex don't let it be livestreamed, as great as it was to watch.

Dennis

Cowboy Dennis said:

Anybody who thinks SVB should be the face of American pool shows they know less about marketing than they do about pool. He's a proven, caught-on-video cheater. That's about like having a video of Tiger kicking his ball from the trees onto the fairway yet still making $40 million a year. Ain't happening.

I hope if there's a re-match that Scott & Alex don't let it be livestreamed, as great as it was to watch.

Dennis

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What?

This is news to me. Could you please elaborate?

JAM said:

What?

This is news to me. Could you please elaborate?

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Jam unfortunately if Pool did take off and become successful and Shane(which is the only chance the sport has) was the face of the sport and everyone was making money. You will always have at least one jealous idiot dying for some attention, trying to ruin something for everyone else. It would be someone who couldn't make it as a player and they would be a bitter and jealous pain in the ass. The pool players could making millions and one asshole would go out of his way to try and send in a video to promoters trying to screw everything up for everyone else to show show "how smart he is". Now mind you, this individual was a half ass player and a sucker and sending that video in would give him no benefit at all. Unfortunately Jam in every sport there are jealous assholes who couldn't cut it so they spend the rest of their lives trying to make sure nobody else gets any rewards.

onepockethacker said:

Jam unfortunately if Pool did take off and become successful and Shane(which is the only chance the sport has) was the face of the sport and everyone was making money. You will always have at least one jealous idiot dying for some attention, trying to ruin something for everyone else. It would be someone who couldn't make it as a player and they would be a bitter and jealous pain in the ass. The pool players could making millions and one asshole would go out of his way to try and send in a video to promoters trying to screw everything up for everyone else to show show "how smart he is". Now mind you, this individual was a half ass player and a sucker and sending that video in would give him no benefit at all. Unfortunately Jam in every sport there are jealous assholes who couldn't cut it so they spend the rest of their lives trying to make sure nobody else gets any rewards.

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So does that mean Shane did *not* cheat?

This is the first I have heard of this, and it is truly hard to believe.

If somebody was to post that Shane is a cheater on AzBilliards, the thread would have 20,000 hits by the end of today

JAM said:

What?

This is news to me. Could you please elaborate?

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Puhleeeeze...Do not get them started up again ! :frus ..A little archival research, on your part, will bring up all the sordid details..
Cowboy is our unoffishul voice of 'conshunce and moralitee' !..Hacker's full time job, is telling him he is full of sh*t !..
(sadly, Shanes error in judgement, is somewhat fact based, and neither will just let it go)..

PS..Jen, I am assuming you know how to bring up ALL past posts, by ANY given member (either here or AZB, where it WAS also posted)..
It is a little off topic though..If every player's indescretion's were pointed out, we could forget worrying about how they 'dressed'

SJDinPHX said:

Puhleeeeze.......Do not get him started again ! :frus A little archival research, on your part, will bring up all the sordid details..

Cowboy is our unoffishul voice of constipation and morality !..

PS..Jen, I am assuming you know how to bring up ALL past posts, by ANY given member (either here or AZB)..

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Oh, sure, I can do that, but I was hoping somebody would provide a link to the video where Shane is accused of not playing fair.

Them's fighting words in some circles, to accuse somebody of cheating.

JAM said:

Oh, sure, I can do that, but I was hoping somebody would provide a link to the video where Shane is accused of not playing fair.

Them's fighting words in some circles, to accuse somebody of cheating.

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Better to let you find out 'off forum'...I am a Shane fan too !...I think that he represents, the best we have to offer !..No need to drag anything thru the mud, AGAIN ! (see edits on post #53)

Cary said:

I have no idea how to do double quotes (maybe SJD will show me some day), but this is actually responding to two posts. Re: the dress of the poor folks back in the day, my grandfather was first a painter, later an independent painting contractor. When actually painting for a living he wore starched & ironed whites--paint spots and all. I remember my grandmother soaking them in tubs of starch and bluing. Later he wore a sport shirt & tie during Houston's summers, adding a sport coat or suit in the winter. He wore a Stetson fedora with either, always, when outside. Also, when I first started in construction nearly 50 years ago, even laborers changed into their good clothes before leaving work. They weren't about to get on the bus in their work clothes.

In August 1966 I went to a Mosconi exhibition in the Florida Keys (I think it was Big Pine Key but it was long, long ago). He wore a suit and tie during the exhibiton, in the non-airconditioned room. Afterwards, he loosened his tie and played a 14.1 money match with one of the local conchs from Key West, still wearing the coat.

P.S. He lost, believe it or not, puling up after the fourth game, having won the first and then losing three straight (all at 150-0). He really didn't look happy about it either.

P.S.S. I didn't know until years later that Mosconi had officially "retired" from competitive pool in 1958.

P.S.S.S. Just for you Sonny, I watched my grandfather pummel a guy half his age to supine unconciousness for cussing in front of my brother and I (we were 12 & 13 at the time). The guy should have heeded the first warning. My, how times have changed.

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Surely you don't think your grandfather was in the right. "Pummeling" someone for saying a cuss word in front of your brother (who, most likely has said the same) is so fifties. I grew up in a refinining town in the south where that red neck behaviour was too common. Solve your problems from the neck up.
Keep it civilized. Alfie

Incidentally, Eddie Taylor never owned a pair of jeans. Other than our time in Hawaii together, I never saw him when he wasn't dressed like he was going to church. He also saw no need for shoe lacing so he wore nice loafers...always shined. On the other hand, that Alfie Taylor couldn't be more of a slob if he tried.

Alfie Taylor said:

Surely you don't think your grandfather was in the right. "Pummeling" someone for saying a cuss word in front of your brother (who, most likely has said the same) is so fifties. I grew up in a refinining town in the south where that red neck behaviour was too common. Solve your problems from the neck up.
Keep it civilized. Alfie

Incidentally, Eddie Taylor never owned a pair of jeans. Other than our time in Hawaii together, I never saw him when he wasn't dressed like he was going to church. He also saw no need for shoe lacing so he wore nice loafers...always shined. On the other hand, that Alfie Taylor couldn't be more of a slob if he tried.

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I can verify that last sentence !..:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

To the people who watched the Scott/Alex match:

Anyone who would register even one complaint about their dress is an imbecile. They were playing what would've been a private gambling match that they, out of the kindness of their hearts, allowed us to view. Only a moron or a miserable old man would complain about what they wore. Again, it was a private gambling match and they owed nothing to anybody. Stop trying to impose your ideas onto the current generation unless they're in a tournament setting, then a certain decorum should be required.

They are not role models for anyone, they already had backers and the game was set so they didn't need to impress anyone. They weren't in church and had to impress nobody.

That said, I will also say this: I don't understand how streaming a match works but cmbwsu streamed this match free of charge for us but he seemed to have no control over the commentators. How does that work? Anybody who was in the chat that night saw that cmbwsu was extremely upset at the language used by Rich. Also, cmbwsu clearly stated that he'd got several potential sponsors to watch the stream and it was very upsetting to him that Rich kept dropping the "F-Bomb". Even after being asked not to drop the "F-Bomb" anymore he still did it several more times. It did not help that the people in the chat kept saying that Rich was not cursing. He was, not overly so and not really annoyingly so (to me) but he was.

cmbwsu said he did a lot of work to get the potential sponsors to watch the stream and he felt they were turned off by the language of Rich. I'll say this about that: If an announcer curses so naturally that he doesn't even realize when he's doing it (as Rich said) he shouldn't be on a stream when it's so important to the streamer. The streamer needs control over this aspect in the future if it's so important to him.

Those things aside, I very much enjoyed Rich's commentary and under ordinary circumstances wouldn't have minded or even noticed (too much) his cursing even though I do expect more from a public commentator. He was extremely knowledgeable and entertaining about one-pocket.

In my opinion Tang Hoa should never be allowed on a livestream again, he's a personable enough fellow but he has a voice made for braille. I felt I was constantly out of breath listening to him gasp for air and breath into the microphone.

To cmbwsu: I appreciated the work you did streaming the match. Alex played some of the greatest one-pocket I've ever seen and he made Scott play a little under his speed as a result. I thank you for your effort and your work.

One Pocket Rich: You are an excellent and very knowledgeable commentator and it was a pleasure to listen to your descriptions of the match and your general banter.

Dennis

demonrho said:

Seems like Lenny is the only one here with a clue. And, the only way for pool to be successfully marketed in the U.S. is like they do in poker...playing off the outlaw aspects.

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What's really funny are "pro" pool player whining about how there's no money in pool.

Take a look around gents, there's a reason why big corporations with the moolah won't toss you a quarter. Hell, even in "The Hustler," the penultimate pool "outlaw" movie, Fast Eddie wore a sports coat and Fats a suit with a carnation.

Of course you can take the short view and say it was a private match and all and both players could be playing with their pants half way to their knees showing their ass crack but the potential is always there for more. Some guys just can't see that far down the road.

Lou Figueroa

For those who missed it or those that forgot it, here is the last 2 1/2 hours of the match. I don't know if parts 1 & 2 have been posted, I couldn't find them.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oS9KrL4z2a4[/ame]