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  #11  
Old 09-30-2019, 02:31 PM
Dennis "Whitey" Young Dennis "Whitey" Young is offline
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This is John's comment about going to a RR format, and was one of the first to comment on my RR thread, pg 35.
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[URL="[QUOTE=jrhendy;244674]I like it and think it is a benefit to the players who come knowing the probability of them going deep in the tournament is low. Everyone gets to play lots of one pocket and a bad draw after traveling a couple thousand miles does not have you sitting on the bench after the first two rounds. It also solves the debate about only going to two on the one loss side.
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There are many favorable RR comments from members that have attended MOT's. John's comment is one of my favorites.

I'd just like to add, and I am sure John would agree; Going to a RR format eliminates the debate of a player being eliminated the first day as with a 3/3 double elimination format. This years MOT had decided to go ahead an eliminate players on the first day, but I believe they mistaken ran it a different way so it did not happen, but it all worked out because they had less entrants. Whitey

Last edited by Dennis "Whitey" Young; 09-30-2019 at 04:32 PM. Reason: added info.
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  #12  
Old 09-30-2019, 03:37 PM
Dennis "Whitey" Young Dennis "Whitey" Young is offline
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Default 14 game RR!

This is a summary of a 14 game RR format!
4 groups of 8 players - each grouping plays on 4 tables - each player plays each other player 2 games totally 14 games equaling 7 rds. of play.

Friday: Play 3 rds. - possibly 4 rds. - at end of 3 rds. of play then evaluate as to feasibility of playing another rd. With a 1pm start then 3rds. would be done in approx. 5-6 hrs. so 6-7pm.

Saturday: Play 4 rds. - play starts @ 10am. 6-7 hrs approx. of play- play ends approx. 4- 5 pm.

Saturday Con't. 4 players from each group of 4 go into rd. of 16, 4 groups of 4 with each group playing on 2 tables playing 1rd. approx. 4-5 hrs. - play ends approx. 9-10 pm. 8 players advance to Sundays final.

Sunday's Final: 8 player single elimination. The players that made the final would of played 10 different players. After Saturday afternoon we are down to using 8 tables.
This format gives time to socialize and match up on Friday and Saturday, does not require 16 tables throughout, and gives a 50/50 chance of advancing out of the rd. of 32 and out of the rd. 16 just like the normal 3/3 double elimination format %, but you get to play more players plus play more games!!!!

Steve: if a poll is taken and lets say this is the results;
3/3 double elimination 15 votes
21 game RR format 10 votes
14 game RR format 10 votes
Then 3/3 has the highest # of votes, but the combination of 21 & 14 RR votes is higher representing a greater vote for change, of which IMO trumps 3/3.

There is also Mr3 cushions 8 groups of 4 players RR format to consider! It plays less games against fewer players, but is a proven format and quarantines to finish on time. Players also have a 50/50 chance of advancing out of rd. of 32 and 16. Whitey
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  #13  
Old 09-30-2019, 04:54 PM
Dennis "Whitey" Young Dennis "Whitey" Young is offline
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Steve;
Should we first have a poll as to which RR format the players would prefer.
I can write up each RR format with their merits. There are 3 to consider.

Then have a poll of winning RR vs. Chip.

Then a final poll of ? vs. 3/3 double elimination.

This way then the votes for RR does not get split up.

Just a suggestion, not sure if I am close on this or not. Any ideas, welcomed. Whitey
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  #14  
Old 09-30-2019, 05:46 PM
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Island Drive Island Drive is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrhendy View Post
IMO it has been very successful the way it is. I would be thrilled to be near the finals any time they are played. There are always people that like to put their on own spin and change things, and sometimes that is good, but this old guy believes if it ainít broke, donít fix it and IMO it ainít broke. Number 1 for me.
John totally agree....but having a chance to play MANY players at an event was thought to be ''important'' and a top concern for us guyz/wanna beeze . If I can play 8 different guys in 2-3 days, that's a hoot. Turn in score sheets, best stats in the final grouping.

Old format.....some go 2 an out and that's that.
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  #15  
Old 09-30-2019, 07:08 PM
Dennis "Whitey" Young Dennis "Whitey" Young is offline
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Here are the 3 RR Formats: anyone that wants to add another or suggest, or correct please do so.

21 game RR Format: 4 groups of 8 players on 4 tables - each player each other 3 games equivalent to 7 rds. 21 games. Friday most all day & Saturday most all day. 2 players from each group or 25% advance to 8 man Sunday Final single elimination.
Pros; more playing time in the tournament, each player plays 7 other players - no eliminated out of tournament the 1st day. Cons; less social and match up time, requires 16 tables in use throughout.

14 game RR Format; 4 groups of 8 players on 4 tables - each player plays each other 2 games equivalent to 7 rds. 14 games - Friday play 3 rds. & Saturday 4 rds. - Sunday Final 8 player single elimination.
Pros; more time to socialize & match up - 50% chance to adv. out of rd. of 32 & rd. of 16. Saturday afternoon 8 tables open up for matching up. No one is eliminated the 1st. day. Each player making it to Sunday Final would of played 10 different players. Cons; can not really think of any, except deciding ties.

Mr3cushions RR Format: 8 groups of 4 playing on 2 tables - each player plays each other a traditional race to 3 - total 9 games - two players out of each group 50% adv. to rd. of 16 which is 4 groups of 4 players playing on 2 tables - 8 players 50% adv. to Sunday Final single elimination.
Pros; this format has been used in 3 cushion billiard tournaments and has been tried and trued. Guaranteed to finish on time. A player getting to the final would of played 7 different players. Probably offers more social time and matching up, and opens up tables after rd. of 32. Maintains the traditional 3/3 dbl. elim. Format. Cons; playing less games than other RR Formats.

Note; Tobermory has made a comment on the 21 game RR, and that is to have 4 players come out of each group, creating 16 player single elimination final on Sunday which is 5 rds. of play. Any comments welcomed!

Any corrections needed please let me know and I'll change it on this post! Whitey
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  #16  
Old 09-30-2019, 10:34 PM
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NH Steve NH Steve is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis "Whitey" Young View Post
Steve;
Should we first have a poll as to which RR format the players would prefer.
I can write up each RR format with their merits. There are 3 to consider.

Then have a poll of winning RR vs. Chip.

Then a final poll of ? vs. 3/3 double elimination.

This way then the votes for RR does not get split up.

Just a suggestion, not sure if I am close on this or not. Any ideas, welcomed. Whitey
I notice when I opened the thread I listed two RR choices which would not be a good idea in an actual poll lol. I think it would be simpler to go the other route -- just 3 basic choices for the poll -- DE, RR & Chip. There are nuances and details to all three of those formats so it really doesn't seem to me it matters a lot on the details ahead of time. But, if a few of you that are advocating an RR want to consult and agree on putting your best foot forward, that seems like a good idea to me.
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  #17  
Old 09-30-2019, 11:32 PM
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I'm indifferent to format. For the most part I have been lucky enough to make it to the final day of all the events I went to...let's call it lucky. Here is the positives for the RR format.
1. Everyone gets a nice amount of play. I assume we all think that's a good thing.
2.You generally have a "Group of Death" where strong players take each other out and thus leaving a "Weaker" group(s) which allow new faces to go farther.
3.Slow Groups don't slow down others. Groups get assigned say two tables. When they are done for day...it's done. The slow group can play all night.

The other formats I'm not familiar with but the chip thing sounds intriguing. I've seen it once and it even allowed people to challenge others (challenger could decline and take his shot at whatever came out of the hat). Nice way to settle grudges etc.Hhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm.

In the end I'm not fussy. Just want everyone to get a chance to play and see friends that I have not seen in a while.
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  #18  
Old 10-01-2019, 12:43 AM
LSJohn LSJohn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick B View Post
I'm indifferent to format. Here is the positives for the RR format.
1. Everyone gets a nice amount of play. I assume we all think that's a good thing.
2.You generally have a "Group of Death" where strong players take each other out and thus leaving a "Weaker" group(s) which allow new faces to go farther.
3.Slow Groups don't slow down others. Groups get assigned say two tables. When they are done for day...it's done. The slow group can play all night.
Good observations, Mr. Nick.

I think you covered it.
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  #19  
Old 10-01-2019, 01:33 AM
Dennis "Whitey" Young Dennis "Whitey" Young is offline
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Nik, death group has been discussed before, and based upon mr3cushion's vast experience, he has advised that it is best to rank the top players and by draw they would be placed in separate groups. We do not want to hamper our best players but want them in the finals, if their play merits it! Whitey

Last edited by Dennis "Whitey" Young; 10-01-2019 at 02:15 AM.
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  #20  
Old 10-01-2019, 01:36 AM
Dennis "Whitey" Young Dennis "Whitey" Young is offline
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Steve: wants the proponents of RR to discuss their position and put forth 1 concensus RR format to go into a poll vs DE & Chip! So let's get it together!
So are there any suggestions how to accomplish this task put forward to us? We thoroughly discussed this on page 35, RR Thread, so this is a source for review and decision making!

1st. we can review the merits of each RR Format proposal, along with the downfalls! We know that most likely we would want 16 tables at least to start with. mr3cushion's format could be done on less tables, and I believe this, for he was working with the Senior Tournament last year regarding his suggestions on a format when using less tables. So considerations towards mr3cushion RR Format needs to be considered if less than 16 tables are available, or if time is an issue and amount of table use.

By the way there is a full thread devoted to solidifying the senior tournament venue on pg. 31. These suggestions could be of use going forth with this year's Senior Tournament!

One factor we need to know from Steve is the # of tables required to pull off a MOT, whether or not it is a RR or DE Format. We'd like 16 for RR Format but what do the traditionalist die hard want for DE?
Another key factor is; 16 tables for Friday and then is it desired to reduced our use of tables at some time before Saturday Night to accommodate their regular clientele.

So Steve; so what if the combined total of RR and Chip out score DE, but DE out scores either one? For me and others, I'd say that this is a voice for change, and unfair to side with DE. Because the vote is split between RR and Chip! But if Chip out scores RR or vise-versa then I would have that leader go into a final poll vs. DE.

What is really funny is where are those that put forth the merits of DE, other than that is the way we have always done it! think about it! Whitey

Last edited by Dennis "Whitey" Young; 10-01-2019 at 02:37 AM.
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