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Old 11-18-2018, 02:23 PM
Dennis "Whitey" Young Dennis "Whitey" Young is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Klamath Falls, Or.
Posts: 1,251

Originally Posted by Island Drive View Post
I agree with you on your explanation this illegal type shot. I might have and easier time pulling this shot off legally with an elevated cue (I'm 6'6'') but how that shot plays out is purely a judgement/referee call. You have to be LIVE in the moment and behind em to make the proper call. This lessens the chance of making a bad call.

As the ref watches the entire match he then knows how each player swings his cue, this is extremely helpful in making the correct call. Someone that just walked in and sat down and saw the same shot. Would they see it the same way as you?

A ref calling balls/strikes at the plate, is in the same spot as a pool ref. making a call. Gotta watch/live.

I remember when Grady first opened his pool room in Colorado Springs a block away from the USOC on 1400 E. Platte. He told us all. If the cue ball is frozen to the object ball ''you are not allowed'' to go forward EVER, automatic foul.
The MOT shot I was referring to could of been called with brail! It was stroked with below center with a gap of approx. a chalk width gap, and yet the cb ball went forward approx. 2-3 inches after contacting the ob head on. Beyond what basic 101 physics allows, a clear push! If the shot was shot with follow then yes, it would of been possible to obtain that cb result legally.

As far as a ref., it is of course best to position yourself to best view the shot, but it does take knowledge to know a foul or the use of an illegal stroke when you see one. And some shots are not physically possible, as mentioned above. A ref. needs to know billiard's basic physics: 'You can not follow the cue ball forward when stroking below center using a level stroke (non elevated stroke) on a close proximity shot', not possible, 'legally'! Easy, easy call!!!

There is an 'illegal shot' long forgotten, but knew during the era of the masters, Mosconi, Crane and so forth, it is called a 'push stroke'! It is where the cb 'rides' the cue tip all the way into the ob and even thru the ob. Therefore it is very possible there is no double click sound involved for the tip can stay in contact with cb, and the ob does not get re-contacted. A very slick shot that most players/ref's would not pick up on. It can be executed within a chalk width or many inches away from the ob. I will do a video thread on this illegal stroke.

As far as Grady's Frozen Cue Ball Rule, this is a house rule of course, and it awards the shooter that freezes the cb to an ob. Nice piece of history, thanks!

I am glad you agree with my assessment of your illegal wwyd shot! thanks, Whitey
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Old 11-18-2018, 03:49 PM
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catkins catkins is offline
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Location: oakland california
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because the stack is not a huge catchers mit I would kick to the bottom rail under the thirteen hoping he screws up trying to put me back in the stack and lets me clear a few balls
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Old 11-18-2018, 06:43 PM
jtompilot jtompilot is offline
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Location: New Orleans
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Originally Posted by Island Drive View Post
But if you push the 4 and make it dead, take a foul, and he fouls back w/o looking at the four, yeah your on two, but he's behind the 14. Am I missing something? Now, I'm going to 10 and he's going to 9.
I move the balls a bit on my intentional. Just waiting for you to continue to make poor moves
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Old 11-24-2018, 05:05 PM
WCRanger WCRanger is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 25

The only reason I would take an intentional is to gain a tactical or positional advantage. I don't see one here. It seems that the only response to any intentional will be a return intentional if a bank/shot is not left available. I like moving the 1 uptable with a stop shot to leave the cue frozen in the stack and just enough speed to catch top rail with the 1. It puts something in play, prepares a wedge if that's where the game ends up moving, but also leaves your opponent in your current position. But I'm a noob so grain of salt and all that.
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