Help with rule

This is the scenario:
Player1 is shooting and makes a ball in Player2 pocket. Player2 owes a ball. At the end of Player1's inning Player2 comes to the table and spots his owed ball before he shoots.

This is how they play at my pool hall. Is this correct. Can someone help me and explain why owed balls are not spotted when the shooter comes to the table?

Marv said:

This is the scenario:
Player1 is shooting and makes a ball in Player2 pocket. Player2 owes a ball. At the end of Player1's inning Player2 comes to the table and spots his owed ball before he shoots.

This is how they play at my pool hall. Is this correct. Can someone help me and explain why owed balls are not spotted when the shooter comes to the table?

Click to expand...

Yes. If the incoming player owes a ball, and the opponent makes it for him, it is spotted before shooting. If, however, the incoming player owed a ball, had one, and had slept it the inning before, it is spotted after each player has a turn at the table.

Marv said:

This is the scenario:
Player1 is shooting and makes a ball in Player2 pocket. Player2 owes a ball. At the end of Player1's inning Player2 comes to the table and spots his owed ball before he shoots.

This is how they play at my pool hall. Is this correct. Can someone help me and explain why owed balls are not spotted when the shooter comes to the table?

Click to expand...

here is a link to our onepocket rules
http://www.onepocket.org/official-one-pocket-rules/
to answer your question
player 2 now has a ball to spot
he spots it before he starts his inning
....
to answer your question bolded
if i understand you correctly
lets say you have a few balls and scratch
you woudnt wait until you shoot again to spot your ball would you ?
when a ball is owed it is spotted whenever it is available

I understand his question. we probably don't even think of it because we have always just played this way.

So, i shoot a ball in my hole and billiard a ball into my opponent's pocket. But my opponent owes one. Why not just spot the ball up right then is what he is asking.

I suppose just think of it like this gets taken care of only at the end of an inning. So if the guy is still shooting his inning isn't over so we don't want to be spotting owed balls back on the table. That could block shots for him or any number of things.

Marv, I am trying to follow and if I have it right, I then believe this is the answer. Scenario 1. Player 2 did not have a ball to spot until you pocketed one for him. Then he spotted it at the end of your inning. Which would be correct.

Scenario 2. Player 2 did have a ball to spot, for the ball owed, but did not spot it at the beginning of your inning, he and you slept it. A forgotten ball, when once realized, is not to be spotted after this 'current' inning, but spotted after the following next inning, which is after player 2's next inning. He actually spotted it to soon.

It is like being in a ring game and you ask to shake the peas. The player's order does not change on the next game but after the game after the next game.

Have fun following that! Whitey

from the rules
9.2 Any penalty balls owed by the shooter, or balls pocketed in a neutral pocket, are to be spotted at the end of the shooter’s inning. However, if a player runs off all the balls on the table without reaching a winning score, then all such balls are spotted immediately (all at once, not one ball at a time), and the shooter continues their inning. At no other time in One Pocket are balls spotted during any shooter’s ongoing inning
...
...
.9.4 If any owed balls, or balls that have fallen into a neutral pocket are forgotten and later remembered, then instead of being spotted after the current shooter’s inning, they are spotted after the end of the next player’s inning, unless there are no balls left on the table, in which case they are all spotted immediately. In any case, any owed balls are not forgiven, but still must be paid.

In practice, forgotten balls may be spotted at any time after they are remembered, as long as both players agree on the timing; if either player objects to an earlier spotting, then rule 9.4 should be followed.
...
...
marv
rule 9.2 the part i bolded explains when to spot the balls
rule 9.4 explains the scenario some members think you are asking
if this is the scenario you mean where player 2 had a ball to spot but it was forgotten the reason you wait an inning is that player 2 when coming to the table could "conveniently" remember he owed a ball when spotting it would give him a shot
same if player 1 remembered you owed a ball at a "convenient "time
hope this helps
btw
welcome to the site...

Help with rule

Thanks for everyone's response. To be clear, in my scenario the shooter that owes a ball didn't "sleep" on his owed ball. He just spots up the ball his opponent made in his pocket. The rule says owed balls are spotted at the end of the inning. Someone responded that it is correct to spot the ball owed before he shoots. Where in the rules does it say that?

My question of "Can someone help me and explain why owed balls are not spotted when the shooter comes to the table?" was to get someone in this forum to help me explain to my pool hall friends why the rule of spotting owed balls at the end of the inning exists. My thought is it prevents the incoming player from having an advantage/disadvantage. The same as the rule for a "missed/forgotten" ball made in an illegal pocket.

Marv said:

Thanks for everyone's response. To be clear, in my scenario the shooter that owes a ball didn't "sleep" on his owed ball. He just spots up the ball his opponent made in his pocket. The rule says owed balls are spotted at the end of the inning. Someone responded that it is correct to spot the ball owed before he shoots. Where in the rules does it say that?

My question of "Can someone help me and explain why owed balls are not spotted when the shooter comes to the table?" was to get someone in this forum to help me explain to my pool hall friends why the rule of spotting owed balls at the end of the inning exists. My thought is it prevents the incoming player from having an advantage/disadvantage. The same as the rule for a "missed/forgotten" ball made in an illegal pocket.

Click to expand...

Spotting it right away could block shots for him or any number of things. So I think to avoid disturbing the shooters inning would be the most probable answer.

Marv said:

My question of "Can someone help me and explain why owed balls are not spotted when the shooter comes to the table?" was to get someone in this forum to help me explain to my pool hall friends why the rule of spotting owed balls at the end of the inning exists. My thought is it prevents the incoming player from having an advantage/disadvantage. The same as the rule for a "missed/forgotten" ball made in an illegal pocket.

Click to expand...

There seems to be some confusion in this thread as regards to what the OP is asking. The above quote implies that the OP does not think that balls are spotted when the shooter comes to the table. He goes on to say that he believes that the current rule is to spot balls at the end of an inning.

I think perhaps the OP does not understand that an inning ends each time a player stops shooting, so, for both players to shoot is two innings.:sorry

Balls are spotted at the end of each inning. The incoming player may very well have a shot due to the spotted ball.

owed balls for either player are paid at the end of the inning that they are made
ie after the current shooter misses or scratches
and before the incoming shooter shoots
except when balls are forgotten then its 2 innings
or if the shooter clears the table but needs more balls to get to his winning count then all balls are spotted at the same time not one by one
why
because thats the rules....
so they are spottted when the new shooter comes to the table except in situations mentioned above (and a few more posts above )

Maybe this is a dead horse by now, but one more try toward clarifying:

As soon as a player realizes that a ball has been slept he notifies his opponent. The player then at the table completes his inning; the other player then takes a turn, and when his inning is completed the slept ball is spotted. However the slept ball may be spotted at any time that both players agree. (If you and your opponent are 100 years old and you're afraid you'll forget to spot it later, go ahead and get it over with. )

Help with rule

"owed balls for either player are paid at the end of the inning that they are made
ie after the current shooter misses or scratches
and before the incoming shooter shoots"

Now this is clearer to me than the way the rules state it. I understood the rule to mean only the player who's inning just ended could spot owed balls. So theoretically, both players could spot owed balls.

Thanks for making that clear. Now I have to go back to my pool hall and admit that I was wrong

Marv said:

"owed balls for either player are paid at the end of the inning that they are made
ie after the current shooter misses or scratches
and before the incoming shooter shoots"

Now this is clearer to me than the way the rules state it. I understood the rule to mean only the player who's inning just ended could spot owed balls. So theoretically, both players could spot owed balls.

Thanks for making that clear. Now I have to go back to my pool hall and admit that I was wrong

Click to expand...

Score is -1 to -1 you have a hanger in your pocket and its your opponents shot. He makes a ball in his hole. His next shot he pockets your hanger.
His inning is now over. Both balls spot. Happens pretty often.

Marv, I just had a previous post that I deleted for the info I provided was incorrect, for I found under rule 6. Fouls, in Grady's comment starting with 'Typical' the 2nd sentence explains that a scored ball pocket for a owed ball is spotted at the end of the scoring inning.

Proper Procedure; is for the outgoing player to always spot the owed ball for the incoming player. In your case since it is advised for opponents not to handle the other's opponent's scored balls then the opponent (the incoming player) should then hand the scored owed ball to the outgoing player to be spotted.

We often see the incoming player impatiently remove a ball from their opponent's collective area and spot it for them, and then even removes their coin for them, and does not give the out going player even a chance to perform their task! The player should always take care of their own scored balls and their coins representing owed balls.

This might go against the grain of some players but spotting balls is very critical at times, and spotting a ball for your self my create an advantage. As of yet these proper procedures are not clearly defined within the rules. So in speaking to your fellow players, it will have to be agreed upon as to who is responsible for spotting balls. I hope this helps you Marv! Whitey