SVB played Scott Frost in Vegas, 8 ahead

[Artie Bodendorfer]

Artie,

If I understand your reasoning properly then you are saying that it's proportionately harder for Scott to run 9 than it is for SVB to run 8, is that right? I understand that you are speaking of an 8-ahead match so little differences are added up over time in the match (if the game is close). I suppose that over the course of a very long match this could be a factor but it seems like the opposite must also be true: the opposite is that it's proportionately easier for SVB to run 7 than it is for Frost to run 8. I guess that in a long, drawn-out, 8-ahead match Frost going to 9 might wear on him to a higher degree than SVB going to 7 might help him. But, since SVB already won playing 8-7 I guess that theory is out the window UNLESS SVB wins handily playing 9-8. I'm gettin' a headache .

P.S. Artie, what did you and Bugs bet when you played each other?

P.PS. If you played him for under $20 a game please don't answer.

Dennis

WE always played 3 out of 5 and we played from athousand to 5 thousand a session.

Witch back then was great action. And you couldnt get Bugs to play for no 20 dollaers a game.

That was not Bugs he could snap hindreds why would he ever but himself down and play for 20 dollers a game.

The cheapest I think I seen him play for was 50 dollaers a game.

But we never played less then 1 thousand dollaers a session. And the most I ever beat him for in one session was 18 thousand.

I would play for a dollaer a game. Because I no what can be won. When the finale count is in.

I played one guy 50 cents a game and I ended up winning 12 thousand dollaers.

So you never no what some body will loose once thier stuck. Im not talking about the everyday people who you no what they will go for.

But I played Bugs even one time and I beat him both sets 2 thousand dollaers a set.

And that was only because I had a mas man woffeing at everyone incloding Bugs.

He was the dangerous Chuck Maddox. And somebody put a gun too his head and blew him away.

He was as dangerous as they come. And thier was no backing up it was eithier you or him.

And he had no dog in him. HE was all balls . And because off him was the only reason I played Bugs even.

And In Detroite the had Bugs the best player in the world.

And he was the most feared player in the country. Bar nobody. And he had the toughest crew in the country behind him too.

But youre first sentence is correct Dennies. And If you had too make a bet who would run out more Shane going to 8 or Scott going too 9 I would bet Shane.

IN any ession they play. Even the one they are playing in now. Its intermission and the will continue and I herd Shanne is 3 games ahead. And was on the hill and Scott made a nice come back.

But they might never finish a session like this and taking 20 to one that the wont finish or call it off is what I would bet.

And when Scott was down 7 games. Do you realize what that player has too do too win.

He has too get 15 games ahead to win the money. THats insane.

Especialy if they made a rule that they play tell someone wines it.

PLaying 8 ahead is like playind a race to 60 games or more. If its a even game.

And nobody might get 8 games ahead. Its way too haed and too much. For two players playing a even game.

Its great foe Shane learning the game thier is nothing better for hi.

But for Scott it must be hard. But 5 ahead is long enough for both players. Because you will play a decent session by the time they finish.

And like I said I would take teo bets. I would bet that shane wins it. And lay 7 to 5 or take 3 to 2 they dont finish the set again.

And will continiue the next day or call it off or change the game if they get back too even.

This is tourture plating 8 ahead. People dont realize howe much harder it is too run 9 balls then 8 balls. Even for a top player.

7 or 8 is about the same. But nine and ten is a different ball game. Just like 10 to 9. Witch could be the next way they play if Shane wines.

But 8 ahead is brutile..Try it a nd see. Ewo people like John a nd me play that way. It might not end in a week or two. Or never.

Thats howe hard it is too get 8 ahead. I dont no who thought off that. But it is brutell..

And If Shane and Scott play 10 to 9 the next new session. I like that even better then 9 to 8.

For Shane because it gives you another chance. And both players love too shoot.

 

[Artie Bodendorfer]

WE always played 3 out of 5 and we played from athousand to 5 thousand a session.

Witch back then was great action. And you couldnt get Bugs to play for no 20 dollaers a game.

That was not Bugs he could snap hindreds why would he ever but himself down and play for 20 dollers a game.

The cheapest I think I seen him play for was 50 dollaers a game.

But we never played less then 1 thousand dollaers a session. And the most I ever beat him for in one session was 18 thousand.

I would play for a dollaer a game. Because I no what can be won. When the finale count is in.

I played one guy 50 cents a game and I ended up winning 12 thousand dollaers.

So you never no what some body will loose once thier stuck. Im not talking about the everyday people who you no what they will go for.

But I played Bugs even one time and I beat him both sets 2 thousand dollaers a set.

And that was only because I had a mas man woffeing at everyone incloding Bugs.

He was the dangerous Chuck Maddox. And somebody put a gun too his head and blew him away.

He was as dangerous as they come. And thier was no backing up it was eithier you or him.

And he had no dog in him. HE was all balls . And because off him was the only reason I played Bugs even.

And In Detroite the had Bugs the best player in the world.

And he was the most feared player in the country. Bar nobody. And he had the toughest crew in the country behind him too.

But youre first sentence is correct Dennies. And If you had too make a bet who would run out more Shane going to 8 or Scott going too 9 I would bet Shane.

IN any ession they play. Even the one they are playing in now. Its intermission and the will continue and I herd Shanne is 3 games ahead. And was on the hill and Scott made a nice come back.

But they might never finish a session like this and taking 20 to one that the wont finish or call it off is what I would bet.

And when Scott was down 7 games. Do you realize what that player has too do too win.

He has too get 15 games ahead to win the money. THats insane.

Especialy if they made a rule that they play tell someone wines it.

PLaying 8 ahead is like playind a race to 60 games or more. If its a even game.

And nobody might get 8 games ahead. Its way too haed and too much. For two players playing a even game.

Its great foe Shane learning the game thier is nothing better for hi.

But for Scott it must be hard. But 5 ahead is long enough for both players. Because you will play a decent session by the time they finish.

And like I said I would take teo bets. I would bet that shane wins it. And lay 7 to 5 or take 3 to 2 they dont finish the set again.

And will continiue the next day or call it off or change the game if they get back too even.

This is tourture plating 8 ahead. People dont realize howe much harder it is too run 9 balls then 8 balls. Even for a top player.

7 or 8 is about the same. But nine and ten is a different ball game. Just like 10 to 9. Witch could be the next way they play if Shane wines.

But 8 ahead is brutile..Try it a nd see. Ewo people like John a nd me play that way. It might not end in a week or two. Or never.

Thats howe hard it is too get 8 ahead. I dont no who thought off that. But it is brutell..

And If Shane and Scott play 10 to 9 the next new session. I like that even better then 9 to 8.

For Shane because it gives you another chance. And both players love too shoot.

THey have played like a day and a half. And thier back too dead even.

Its hard for me to emagine playing 8 games ahead. That is very hard too do with two great players.

And a close game. This might be one off the best learning games for someone. Who wants too learn.

Go thier with a note book and start righting down eveything you are learning.

And thier is a lot too learn. And you also learn what twh great shooters and players. Do against eack other.

I still think Shane will win. Or the will call it a draw and call the session of.

Thats howe I see it. Scott is playing better. And is he plays his top game. He could win.

But eight ahead I would like too take 7 to 5 and bet each time they play. It will bw a no decision. Or continued.

But thier playing some great pool. And if you get a chance too watch it.

I would recomend you watch it because you will not see too meny sessions like this or as long.

I hope they dont loose all the money on time. And Shane is having big fun learning the game.

Tommarow they get too do it all over again. And with the pocker tournement starting.

A lot off gambling faces will sgow up. But these are great sessions too watch.

And I like too bet the players will out last the Watchers.

 

[Fast Lenny]

Sweat bet anyone? I like Frost for a few hundred.

 

[wincardona]

Artie,

If I understand your reasoning properly then you are saying that it's proportionately harder for Scott to run 9 than it is for SVB to run 8, is that right? I understand that you are speaking of an 8-ahead match so little differences are added up over time in the match (if the game is close). I suppose that over the course of a very long match this could be a factor but it seems like the opposite must also be true: the opposite is that it's proportionately easier for SVB to run 7 than it is for Frost to run 8. I guess that in a long, drawn-out, 8-ahead match Frost going to 9 might wear on him to a higher degree than SVB going to 7 might help him. But, since SVB already won playing 8-7 I guess that theory is out the window UNLESS SVB wins handily playing 9-8. I'm gettin' a headache .

P.S. Artie, what did you and Bugs bet when you played each other?

P.PS. If you played him for under $20 a game please don't answer.

Dennis

For a lesser player 9/8 will never be as good as 8/7. There are too many scenarios that 8/7 is better than 9/8. Just because in this match up some one believes that in one particular scenario why 9/8 is better than 8/7 what about in the other 100's of scenarios where 8/7 is better than 9/8?

The only way I see that 9/8 is better than 8/7 is that the player getting the weight is a substantial favorite playing even with the other player. If the best player is getting the weight and he is a big favorite playing even than 11/10 is better than 5/4 in a ball spot. Stretching the game out will favor the best player in the scenario that I just described.

But in this match up with Shane and Scott 8/7 is clearly better for Shane than 9/8.

I really don't have the time, energy, and patience to debate this any farther. Billy I.

 

[Artie Bodendorfer]

For a lesser player 9/8 will never be as good as 8/7. There are too many scenarios that 8/7 is better than 9/8. Just because in this match up some one believes that in one particular scenario why 9/8 is better than 8/7 what about in the other 100's of scenarios where 8/7 is better than 9/8?

The only way I see that 9/8 is better than 8/7 is that the player getting the weight is a substantial favorite playing even with the other player. If the best player is getting the weight and he is a big favorite playing even than 11/10 is better than 5/4 in a ball spot. Stretching the game out will favor the best player in the scenario that I just described.

But in this match up with Shane and Scott 8/7 is clearly better for Shane than 9/8.

I really don't have the time, energy, and patience to debate this any farther. Billy I.

I win another bet. THe called the session off.

I new it was too brutole too pla y 8 games ahead. THat neither player might win.

And I said I like Shane or the session will get called. And thats what happened ir was called,

Due too too meny houers off playing and no decision. But I no They will play again.

I dont no when. Or howe. But I think if they play again thet 8 ahead will be changed.

My Belife. BUt it was a great work out for Shane.

A learning experience. And like I said that was a freatest comebaclk in pool that I ever herd.

Playing 8 ahead and being stuck 7 games. And comeing back and getting even.

It was like winning a session 8 ahead for Scotts People. Byr what woold have made it the cook die gra if Scott would have wone the 8 ahead session too.

Instead off breacking even. In that set. But the bettoers must have loved it Scott getting back too even.

 

[newfosgatesucks]

I'm just saying a jump to even may be "considered" out of order, though I don't feel it is. But I'm not the Stake horse!

Do you really think the ball meant anything? How many games did he get to "7" that he could not have gotten "8". I think Scott would have his hands full playing them all even! That one ball doesn't mean shit to someone who runs the balls like Shane. Hell, he might have been able to spot Scott 8-7!

 

[Artie Bodendorfer]

I win another bet. THe called the session off.

I new it was too brutole too pla y 8 games ahead. THat neither player might win.

And I said I like Shane or the session will get called. And thats what happened ir was called,

Due too too meny houers off playing and no decision. But I no They will play again.

I dont no when. Or howe. But I think if they play again thet 8 ahead will be changed.

My Belife. BUt it was a great work out for Shane.

A learning experience. And like I said that was a freatest comebaclk in pool that I ever herd.

Playing 8 ahead and being stuck 7 games. And comeing back and getting even.

It was like winning a session 8 ahead for Scotts People. Byr what woold have made it the cook die gra if Scott would have wone the 8 ahead session too.

Instead off breacking even. In that set. But the bettoers must have loved it Scott getting back too even.

Adolp had a lot off cousines that were doctors. And Her Schiltze says I see nosing. Hogans Heros.

Ino they wont make any mistakes. Because they are mistake free doctors.

BUt you will be the one going through the experience. And when we are the patient. THen we can only hope for the best.

I learned something deom this I never knew a doctor needs a doctor.

But a mistakle free doctor. Is high on the demand list.

Tell the doctor you like Souercute. And Winer Schnetzel. And they have some great beer.

And the nurses are Gorge.

 

[lll]

like the old tv show "just the facts please"
could some one tell me short and sweet what happened in each seession between scott and shane ??
thanks

 

[Fatboy]

For a lesser player 9/8 will never be as good as 8/7. There are too many scenarios that 8/7 is better than 9/8. Just because in this match up some one believes that in one particular scenario why 9/8 is better than 8/7 what about in the other 100's of scenarios where 8/7 is better than 9/8?

The only way I see that 9/8 is better than 8/7 is that the player getting the weight is a substantial favorite playing even with the other player. If the best player is getting the weight and he is a big favorite playing even than 11/10 is better than 5/4 in a ball spot. Stretching the game out will favor the best player in the scenario that I just described.

But in this match up with Shane and Scott 8/7 is clearly better for Shane than 9/8.

I really don't have the time, energy, and patience to debate this any farther. Billy I.

there is no need to debate it, its clear.

 

[lll]

like the old tv show "just the facts please"
could some one tell me short and sweet what happened in each seession between scott and shane ??
thanks

got the answer from billy I.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=3041202&postcount=1

 

[Artie Bodendorfer]

there is no need to debate it, its clear.

If you read my post you will see that I said 8 to 7 is better then 9 to 8. Its better period.

If you make a price or line on 8 to 7 and 9 to 8 everyone everyone knowes 8 to 7 is better then 9 to 8 nobody ever said it wasant. I dont no why you would even debaye this.

Its clear as our age that 8 to 7 is better then 9 to 8. What I said 9 to 8 is better for Shane. Because Ge will run 8 or 7 and he is the better shooter.

And 9 to 8 is harder for Scott too run then 8 balls. Especialy latter on in the game.

But I dont want too get into all the deyails on this. Because most leople would not understand it.

And we definatly no that Shane will run more eights rhen Scott nine. And If someone wamted to bet that if Shane is runing out that he will run 7 or 8 about the same way.

Were Scott will not run 9 as easy as 8 because the balls are in tougher positions.

And nobody realy ever studied that. Straight pool plYERS MIGHT.

bUT TAKE LIKE 3 OR 4 BALLS OFF THE RABLE AND YOU WILL REALY SEE HOWE HARD IT IS TO RUN 9 OVER 8.

aND i WOULD ALSU BET THAT IF SHANE IS RUNNING OUT HE WILL RUN 8 WAY MORE THEN Scott runs 9.

People just dont no that its way harder to run 9 then 8 .

And next time they play. Just see who runs out the most . When the one player is at 7 and needs 8 or the player that is on 8 and needs 9.

WAtch and you will see what I am saying is correct.

And I am not saying that 9 to 8 is better then 8 to 7 because its not.

And that can be proven matamatical. So thier os nothing too talk about. Witch is the better percentage game 8 to 7 or 9 to 8.

And I played Bugs all the time. I could have gotten 8 to 7. But I took 9 to 8.

Not that 8 to 7 wasant better. But because I wanted too make it as hard as possable.

And I new if I would run 7 I would run 8. But that is not true in the same casr.

If I run 8 its harder to run 9. You have too see it and then you wiill belive it.

If you had a tape off Scotts Games and Shane. You could see what happened.

Even the first time they played. Look at were shane ran out and you will see that he could have run 8 balls.

But 9 and 10 gets a lot tricker.

And 10 to 9 is even garder. But you have too look at all the games were players ran out.

And see if the could have ran 9 or not. If you are a good shooter like Shane. You want too make it as hard as possable for Scott.

Its not about him needing 7 or 8 . He will get them both because off his shooting.

But is will make it harder for Scott. I did not watch them play. Howe meny 9 and ots did Scott run.

Shane has no problems running balls. Whem he gets a good shot too run out. He will run out.

And 9 or 8 is a tougher roite to go. And Scott can win. Because its a tough game for both players.

And next time the play. See who runs out and who is a ball short.

And that will be Scott. For a weeker shooter the 8 to 7 is what he needs.

But not a stronger shooter. That can run balls as good as Scott.

 

[Cowboy Dennis]

The only way I see that 9/8 is better than 8/7 is that the player getting the weight is a substantial favorite playing even with the other player. If the best player is getting the weight and he is a big favorite playing even than 11/10 is better than 5/4 in a ball spot. Stretching the game out will favor the best player in the scenario that I just described.

So then I guess you are saying that 8-7 is stronger than 9-8 unless a weaker player is spotting a better player. In that scenario 8-7 is less weight to give up than 9-8. I've got it now, thanks.

P.S. To all who are considering giving up 9-8 to a better player, DON'T!!! Try instead to get him to accept 8-7.

RBL

 

[Cowboy Dennis]

To any and all who may be overthinking this: 8-7 is more weight than 9-8. It doesn't change because of who is playing or their speed or how well they run balls. The balls don't know who's shooting them. If 8-7 is stronger than 9-8, which it is, that cannot be changed due to who is playing. 8-7 is either stronger or it's not, and it is.

Most of us on this site also know that it's harder to run 8 balls than 7 balls, 9 balls than 8 balls, 10 balls than 9 balls, 11 balls than 10 balls. We get that, for the most part, so no need to reiterate. On the other hand, if you threw in one free scratch per game that would really change things up.

RBL

 

[androd]

To any and all who may be overthinking this: 8-7 is more weight than 9-8. It doesn't change because of who is playing or their speed or how well they run balls. The balls don't know who's shooting them. If 8-7 is stronger than 9-8, which it is, that cannot be changed due to who is playing. 8-7 is either stronger or it's not, and it is.

Most of us on this site also know that it's harder to run 8 balls than 7 balls, 9 balls than 8 balls, 10 balls than 9 balls, 11 balls than 10 balls. We get that, for the most part, so no need to reiterate. On the other hand, if you threw in one free scratch per game that would really change things up.

RBL

You Rascal you.

 

[wincardona]

So then I guess you are saying that 8-7 is stronger than 9-8 unless a weaker player is spotting a better player. In that scenario 8-7 is less weight to give up than 9-8. I've got it now, thanks.

P.S. To all who are considering giving up 9-8 to a better player, DON'T!!! Try instead to get him to accept 8-7.

RBL

I don't know if you're serious but what I said is 100% correct. Let me share a story with you that will confirm my beliefs. Plus it will open the eyes of any one that has their doubts.

15 years ago in Baton Rouge Cooney was spotting Fly Boy playing one pocket the break and ball in hand, Fly Boy was playing Cooney 8/7. So to simplify things Fly Boy was getting the break and ball in hand after the break and giving Cooney a ball 8/7. Does every one understand the game? Good. It was a tough game but Cooney edged him out and won. So the next day I said to Fly Boy that I would give him the break and ball in hand after the break and I would take a lesser spot of 9/8. He thought a while and agreed to play the game. My game was a much better game than Cooney's game which I won with easily.

Now can you understand that 9/8 is better than 8/7 in this scenario? Only because the better player was getting THE BALL SPOT.

Trust me, i'm a doctor

Billy I.

 

[wincardona]

So then I guess you are saying that 8-7 is stronger than 9-8 unless a weaker player is spotting a better player. In that scenario 8-7 is less weight to give up than 9-8. I've got it now, thanks.

P.S. To all who are considering giving up 9-8 to a better player, DON'T!!! Try instead to get him to accept 8-7.

RBL

If you're ever playing a player that is 10/7 better than you and you have a choice of giving him 9/8 or 2/1 play him 2/1.

Billy I.

 

[Cowboy Dennis]

I don't know if you're serious but what I said is 100% correct. Let me share a story with you that will confirm my beliefs. Plus it will open the eyes of any one that has their doubts.

15 years ago in Baton Rouge Cooney was spotting Fly Boy playing one pocket the break and ball in hand, Fly Boy was playing Cooney 8/7. So to simplify things Fly Boy was getting the break and ball in hand after the break and giving Cooney a ball 8/7. Does every one understand the game? Good. It was a tough game but Cooney edged him out and won. So the next day I said to Fly Boy that I would give him the break and ball in hand after the break and I would take a lesser spot of 9/8. He thought a while and agreed to play the game. My game was a much better game than Cooney's game which I won with easily.

Now can you understand that 9/8 is better than 8/7 in this scenario? Only because the better player was getting THE BALL SPOT.

Trust me, i'm a doctor

Billy I.

That's all well & good Bill but giving up the break and BIH after the break is not what we're talking about.

P.S. Am I correct in thinking that BIH after the break means that he got to take BIH and keep shooting after he broke, whether or not he pocketed a ball on the break?

Dennis

 

[Cowboy Dennis]

If you're ever playing a player that is 10/7 better than you and you have a choice of giving him 9/8 or 2/1 play him 2/1.

Billy I.

I think I may just hold out for the 10-7 if you don't mind .

RBL

 

[Artie Bodendorfer]

I think I may just hold out for the 10-7 if you don't mind .

RBL

THats almost as good as playing a player giving you 8 to 1. And then when its over he pulls out his gun an takes all youre money.

I didnt no the circus was comeing too town.

 

[lll]

ok lets start again
im the weaker player matching up with you
you offer me 9/8 or 8/7 my choice
which do i take ??

im the weaker player matching up with you
im going to spot you
i say ill give you 9/8 or 8/7
which one do i hope you take?


next scenario
you the better player tell me i get the break(worth 1 1/2 -2 balls supposedly)
but tell me only if i give you (the better player) a spot in the score
you the better player tells me he'll take 9/8 or 8/7
which should i pick???

for the record the weaker player i dont think should ever spot the better player