joyner /cooney game 4

[Jimmy B]

...not giving my oppo an opportunity to put all 3 balls in play and put me uptable?

If y'all notice, no matter what Jack does now, Cliff will have an opportunity to make some kind of bank or be able to keep all 3 in play.

Shooting the shot, "that no other top player would ever choose." -- MINE. Would have made it next to impossible for your oppo to win the game on the next shot or the shot after that. Shooting the Cardone, Duck, "Top Player" selections resulted, as I had predicted with Cliff having an opportunity to cross over a ball, leaving everything open, and sending the cue ball up table. Does anyone not see that?

Incidentally, if anyone has heard any of my commentary on accu-stats, they would have noticed that I dont too often agree with the shot choices of the "Top Players" that I am commenting on. Example: When I was in the booth with Billy I, and Ronnie A, when Buddy Hall was playing Marco Marques at Baton Rouge, Ronnie commented on the poor choices both Buddy and Marco were making. His quote to ME, "They just dont know the game like you and I do." end quote. All 3 of us were in the booth at that time. I cant say for sure if his exclusion of Billy in that quote was an just oversight on Ronnie's part or not. Maybe he just wanted to bust Billy's balls. Or maybe not.

Beard

Now Billy, before you say something you will regret, your ex, on FaceBook, has invited herself and you, over for more meatballs in August.

I got you doing a match with Buddy playing Ray Martin and Bill and Ronnie are in the booth. Ronnie kept making smart ass remarks and tried to put your choices down a couple of times. You and Bill did great jobs but RA kept acting bored or something and saying things like "I would just run out and rack em up" Your thoughts were excellent specifically about the player needing 3 was not that big of a dog with the guy needing 1 in certain spots ie one mistake by either player could end the game. I gave you and Bill a solid A and RA a C- on that match. I also like your shot with three on the spot. I played weaker players and distance screwed them up something fierce and on my home tables I was sure to put the cue ball back up there near the rail so I choose that for me. I use to lag to the rail with anybody in the world but not for huge money. I also would throw to the line with anyone. Throwing to the line a lot seemed to help with speed control on a pool table. I threw on carpet, asphalt or dirt and sand. On dirt and sand it was in the crack almost every time. I was beaten only once in my memory by a guy who had did a lot of time in prison and we were throwing on indoor outdoor carpet and we had to throw above the line and make the coins bounce backwards a few inches. He had spent so many hours in the bucket throwing coins I just couldn't beat him. He was almost perfect..........

 

[SJDinPHX]

Birds of a feather..etc..

Birds of a feather..etc..

A good measure of intelligence...is how much someone agrees with me. That would make you a very smart man. See my post #13.

Beard

If I remember correctly, Clarebaby had a few choice words for Mr. Beatle..(causing Mr. Beatle, to take an extended vacation)
Sorry, but I just cannot recall any one of those words being.."intelligent"...

Mopey Duck <---Would have had Cliffy shooting off the bottom rail...Hugh difference, sir

 

[SJDinPHX]

dick the diagram for the 2 balls on the spot shows the back ball going up table.
you are hitting the balls softer since you want them to cluster around the spot as per your post
http://onepocket.org/forum/showpost.php?p=73134&postcount=15

do you shoot the the 2 balls on the spot softly also??

No Larry, with 2 balls, I will shoot it just like the link shows....But, unless the table is very fast, the 2 ball will not travel as far as shown...Or, possibly, on certain tables, I may shoot the same shot Jack shot, (with the 3 balls on the spot).

Its always been a "table speed, comfort level, cueball feel" thingy, with me. I always try to avoid shooting shots, that I am not pretty sure of the outcome...Don't always happen, but I try..

 

[lll]

No Larry, with 2 balls, I will shoot it just like the link shows....But, unless the table is very fast, the 2 ball will not travel as far as shown...Or, possibly, on certain tables, ! may shoot the same shot Jack shot, (with 3 balls on the spot).

Its always been a "table speed, comfort level, cueball feel" thingy, with me. I always try to avoid shooting shots, that I am not pretty sure of the outcome...Don't always happen, but I try..

thanks for the reply sjd
now what would you (or anyone else) do now
its jacks shot (we are getting close to putting this thread to end but...
NOT YET

 

[SJDinPHX]

thanks for the reply sjd
now what would you (or anyone else) do now
its jacks shot (we are getting close to putting this thread to end but...
NOT YET
View attachment 3396

I don't see anything agressive, to like here Larry. (especially needing only one ball)... I would probably one rail the stripe (by the spot,)..up table, and try and tie up the 9 ball...Leaving the cue ball...middle diamond, bottom rail.

Please remember, all my responses, are based on ideal results...As you well know, "The best laid plans, of mice and men...etc...

El Duck <---Just hates to give up control of the table...(unlike some guy's from Chicago, many of whom seem to favor, poor percentage shots)...

 

[lll]

I don't see anything agressive, to like here Larry. (especially needing only one ball)... I would probably one rail the stripe (by the spot,)..up table, and try and tie up the 9 ball...Leaving the cue ball...middle diamond, bottom rail.

Please remember, all my responses, are based on ideal results...As you well know, "The best laid plans, of mice and men...etc...

El Duck <---Just hates to give up control of the table...(unlike some guy's from Chicago, many of whom seem to favor, poor percentage shots)...

dick if you one rail the stripe closest to the foot rail and leave the q on the middle diamond doesnt that leave a free bank on the other stripe for joyner??

 

[wincardona]

]thanks for the reply sjd
now what would you (or anyone else) do now
its jacks shot (we are getting close to putting this thread to end but...
NOT YET
View attachment 3396[
I agree one rail the 14 ball toward the 9 ball Joyner will have nothing offensive to shoot and an uptable game is inevitable.

Freddie, playing your thin hit with 3 balls on the spot is too risky for the situation, you can scratch in either the side or corner pocket, why risk that if you don't have to. Playing Cooney's shot is the best % shot imo, nothing Joyner can do to gain an advantage. Particularly if he is snookered from the head ball.

Also there are offensive shots available off your thin hit like banking the second ball cross corner or playing Joyners favorite shot by double banking the bottom ball two cusions and sending the head ball to his side, the cue ball will go 3 cusions and end up , up table near the corner pocket. Yea you may say it's a risky shot but the way Joyner hits it it looks like a strong shot, plus he needs all 3 balls. Your shot is playing into Joyners hand and you'll get burned with it. Coooney's shot is starting an uptable game with 3 balls on the table and him needing only one. Wake up and smell the coffee.
Dr. Billy I.

 

[wincardona]

dick if you one rail the stripe closest to the foot rail and leave the q on the middle diamond doesnt that leave a free bank on the other stripe for joyner??

No there are no free banks available, the 9 ball blocks the bank on the stripe in the middle of the table and he cannot bank any other ball because of the stripe that he must defend against in the middle of the table.

Billy I.

 

[lll]

since you are the doctor ill take your advice that the 9 blocks the bank
what would you shoot now if you were cooney???
btw is your back holding up to the exercise its getting on vacation??

 

[wincardona]

since you are the doctor ill take your advice that the 9 blocks the bank
what would you shoot now if you were cooney???
btw is your back holding up to the exercise its getting on vacation??

I already answered that question, I would shoot Dicks shot and send the stripe toward the 9 ball and try to freeze the cue ball on the rail. Now it's Joyners shot.

Billy I.

 

[lll]

I already answered that question,

Billy I.

billy thats not the question
hows your back with the extra exercise

 

[lll]

if you are cooney would anyone move the 9 to their side and let the q go to the foot rail????
would anyone try to bank the middle stripe to the corner???

 

[SJDinPHX]

if you are cooney would anyone move the 9 to their side and let the q go to the foot rail????
would anyone try to bank the middle stripe to the corner???

I sure wouldn't..thats not the right shot Larry... Besides, the cue is frozen, and it looks like a dead scratch to me...

 

[petie]

if you are cooney would anyone move the 9 to their side and let the q go to the foot rail????
would anyone try to bank the middle stripe to the corner???

If it's laying right, and it is hard to see from this angle, I'd move the nine as close to my pocket as I could and try to draw/spin whitie up to the head rail near the left corner pocket. I think I could do this by haviing the 9 ball contact the side rail just north of the side pocket. This would present my opponent with a dangerous ball near my pocket (the 9) and nothing but difficult cross banks for offensive shots. He would have to deal with the 9.

 

[SJDinPHX]

If it's laying right, and it is hard to see from this angle, I'd move the nine as close to my pocket as I could and try to draw/spin whitie up to the head rail near the left corner pocket. I think I could do this by haviing the 9 ball contact the side rail just north of the side pocket. This would present my opponent with a dangerous ball near my pocket (the 9) and nothing but difficult cross banks for offensive shots. He would have to deal with the 9.

Petie, How do propose to draw/spin, from froze on the rail ?..

Bottom line, Cliff need all 3 balls, Cooney does not have to gamble, period. Just move another ball uptable, and, and take it out of play...Then Cliff will have to deal with the 9 ball..

 

[wincardona]

Petie, How do propose to draw/spin, from froze on the rail ?..

Bottom line, Cliff need all 3 balls, Cooney does not have to gamble, period. Just move another ball uptable, and, and take it out of play...Then Cliff will have to deal with the 9 ball..

Petie, Dick has given us all good advice, shot selections in this particular game, his reasoning is sound and to the point. Go back through his reasoning for what he suggest and learn. And if you want to try the advance course, listen to the Dr. But the advance course very seldom differs friom SJD course, unless he's wrong.

Have a nice day and shoot Dicks shots.

Dr. Billy I..

 

[petie]

Petie, How do propose to draw/spin, from froze on the rail ?..

Bottom line, Cliff need all 3 balls, Cooney does not have to gamble, period. Just move another ball uptable, and, and take it out of play...Then Cliff will have to deal with the 9 ball..

Of course you would be right and I (the comparative rookie to your years of high stakes/high level play) would be wrong. I knew this last night right after I posted my dumb shot but was headed for bed (yes around 9 as I get up at 5 and had worked all day on our yard and garden in the heat and was exhaused.) I thought I would wake up to abject ridicule for the shot but it wasn't as bad as I deserve. Spin/draw or draw/spin is out of the question unless you were the one needing all the balls and even then probably not.

Both you and the Doctor exercised very kind restraint in correcing me. Thank you both. I really do learn a lot from both of you and others too.

Petie

 

[lll]

well jack didnt listen to sjd,billy,or petie
he chose to bank the middle sripe (14?) ball to his pocket
like this

 

[lll]

leaving cliff like this

 

[lll]

here is a close up of how the ball is sitting near the pocket
dont forget the 9 ball is up table