Played a long gambling match of bank yesterday.

backplaying

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Ricky peppers called me late yesterday and told me some players were in town wanting to play some bank pool. We played from 8pm yesterday until noon today. It was the first full rack bank I had played in years, big difference from used to playing with 9 balls. I don't think I have ever seen a guy so deadly on cross side banks. He also played tighter than anyone I had ever played and when he would thin off the balls to bring the cueball back down table, I felt lucky if it was a inch off the rail. His weakness was the long rail banks but he wouldn't go for one unless he was close to it. It took this long to play one 5 ahead set. I had met him at a tournament in Memphis awhile back and didn't remember him at first. Missing many cross sides cost me the match, but I had only played bank on a diamond a couple of times and I just seemed to have a hard time with those but played the long rails good. Diamonds plays nothing like a Goldcrown. How hard was it for others here to ajust from a goldcrown to a diamond playing anything? and did you ever get to where you played as good on a diamond?
 

backplaying

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Well, they came back through yesterday and we ended up playing 9 ball banks, big mistake on my part. I got drilled for a couple of dimes in about 12 hrs.. He out moved me and I still had problems missing many easy cross sides that would cost me the game. I would need to put many hours of practice on a diamond to beat a good bank player. These pockets were also 4 1/4", which played tough. Banking Billy is what they call him, he's a black guy about 6-6 from the Memphis area I think. I had my nose open and told him we could go 40 miles and play on a goldcrown, which he refused. I had played most of my bank pool years ago on a barbox and very little on a 9 footer, big difference on safety play. It was awhile until I realized me not making sure balls where on both ends of the table was really playing into his out moving me and beating me to the shot. John B and Freddy, if your reading this do you get into the defensive part of the game in your instructional video?
 

fred bentivegna

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Well, they came back through yesterday and we ended up playing 9 ball banks, big mistake on my part. I got drilled for a couple of dimes in about 12 hrs.. He out moved me and I still had problems missing many easy cross sides that would cost me the game. I would need to put many hours of practice on a diamond to beat a good bank player. These pockets were also 4 1/4", which played tough. Banking Billy is what they call him, he's a black guy about 6-6 from the Memphis area I think. I had my nose open and told him we could go 40 miles and play on a goldcrown, which he refused. I had played most of my bank pool years ago on a barbox and very little on a 9 footer, big difference on safety play. It was awhile until I realized me not making sure balls where on both ends of the table was really playing into his out moving me and beating me to the shot. John B and Freddy, if your reading this do you get into the defensive part of the game in your instructional video?


I address this particular strategy on my website in the Bank pool lessons page:

MORE STRATEGY
To counter safety play designed to slow the game up and meant to discourage aggressive shooting, you need to place at least two balls at the head of the table.

In the beginning of the game, look to put your opponent underneath a ball or balls at the foot of the table (where you rack the balls). By that I mean you should try to freeze him behind the main body of balls at the foot of the table. You want to keep the opposition from returning the Cue Ball to the back rail (head of the table).

When an opponent leaves you at the foot of the table your main job is to ignore any marginal shots you may have and instead shoot at least one ball to the head or end rail, and snooker your opponent to keep him from seeing, and then being able to move that ball back to the foot of the table.

If opponents are snookered they will not play a safety to the head rail because that would allow you to either have a shot at the ball that you previously put there, or you could shoot it away and leave him frozen on the back rail and far away from the body of balls.

Since you are going to be left at the foot of the table again, you ignore any marginal shots — your main objective is to get two balls up table by shooting a second ball up to the head of the table — completing your mission.

If that is not possible, play again to snooker your foe from seeing the balls on the head rail and force your opponent to leave you among the balls at the foot of the table again.

Once two balls are at the back end (head) of the table, refrain from shooting a marginal straight-back with any one of them. Because once you miss your opponent will remove the remaining ball there by either playing safe or playing a shot with it. In either case you will be back where you started. Better to find another ball to shoot to the head rail (as a move) to bring the count to three. The more balls at the head of the table the merrier.

Conversely, if you are the one trying to slow the game down, then you would naturally look to remove any single ball from the head of the table to keep two balls from collecting there.


Beard
 

usblues

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Speaking for....

Speaking for....

....myself[of course],I always found it easier to beat a real good player playing full rack rather than 9-ball banks,cheers,James PS.Good stuff Freddie
 

gulfportdoc

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Jun 25, 2004
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Gulfport, Mississippi
BP-- in comment to your first post, Diamond tables notoriously bank short in comparison to Gold Crown's, due to the difference in the rails. If you were missing cross-side's, you may have been missing them short as a result. So a guy has to play them longer, or use outside english; or as JB does on some cross-sides, shoot the ball long, but straighten it out with inside english.

I experience a slightly similar problem. Since my play in the last 13 years has been almost exclusively on wet Diamonds, which play super short, when I go up North to a tournament, or into a place that is continually climate controlled, even on Diamonds I have to aim to allow for a wider rebound angle.

I believe that Diamond has addressed this disparity in their new "blue label" rails, which are more like Gold Crowns, but not completely.

Doc
 

backplaying

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I address this particular strategy on my website in the Bank pool lessons page:

MORE STRATEGY
To counter safety play designed to slow the game up and meant to discourage aggressive shooting, you need to place at least two balls at the head of the table.

In the beginning of the game, look to put your opponent underneath a ball or balls at the foot of the table (where you rack the balls). By that I mean you should try to freeze him behind the main body of balls at the foot of the table. You want to keep the opposition from returning the Cue Ball to the back rail (head of the table).

When an opponent leaves you at the foot of the table your main job is to ignore any marginal shots you may have and instead shoot at least one ball to the head or end rail, and snooker your opponent to keep him from seeing, and then being able to move that ball back to the foot of the table.

If opponents are snookered they will not play a safety to the head rail because that would allow you to either have a shot at the ball that you previously put there, or you could shoot it away and leave him frozen on the back rail and far away from the body of balls.

Since you are going to be left at the foot of the table again, you ignore any marginal shots — your main objective is to get two balls up table by shooting a second ball up to the head of the table — completing your mission.

If that is not possible, play again to snooker your foe from seeing the balls on the head rail and force your opponent to leave you among the balls at the foot of the table again.

Once two balls are at the back end (head) of the table, refrain from shooting a marginal straight-back with any one of them. Because once you miss your opponent will remove the remaining ball there by either playing safe or playing a shot with it. In either case you will be back where you started. Better to find another ball to shoot to the head rail (as a move) to bring the count to three. The more balls at the head of the table the merrier.

Conversely, if you are the one trying to slow the game down, then you would naturally look to remove any single ball from the head of the table to keep two balls from collecting there.


Beard

Thanks for the responce. I found when we played full rack banks I did move as good and made the long rails much better than he did, but when you miss a easy cross side where you should get three and end up giving up 3, its hard to outrun. Playing mostly banks on a barbox leaving someone long didn't mean much on those big pocket valleys. I will check out your video's along with johns as I clearly see I need alot of help on the moving part on a 9 ft diamond. Yea Doc, I was tearing those tits up on many of the side pockets missed shots. Peppers who was betting on me, said Billy you remember what a very smart person once said about doing the same thing and expecting a different result means. Wasn't to funny at the time though!
 

NH Steve

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Apr 25, 2004
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12,392
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New Hampshire
I too play mostly on Gold Crowns. I find the Diamonds to be very speed sensitive compared to Gold Crowns -- i.e. the Diamonds seem to open up on soft shots much more than Gold Crowns do, and likewise they shorten up better than Gold Crowns do.
 

Fatboy

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Feb 27, 2007
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Vegas & LA
Diamonds plays nothing like a Goldcrown. How hard was it for others here to ajust from a goldcrown to a diamond playing anything? and did you ever get to where you played as good on a diamond?


i'm far from being a great bank player, however on a very good day on a box i'm used to playing short rack(9balls) I can run 3's & the occasional 4 on a Gold Crown. On a Diamond I seem to run 2 and the occasional 3. On a not so good day I run 2's and the occasional 3 on a GC and 1' &2's on Diamonds. Point is i'm a full ball behind on a Diamond. I only started playing banks a few years ago, however i been playing for 28 years mostly on GC's and have never been able to play as well on a Diamond(all games). Especially banking on a Diamond.
 
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