the break and table conditions

Where do you place the cueball for the break uder the following conditions:

1. New cloth {Somonis 860}

2. Very humid conditions.

3.When you have to rack the balls above the spot to get em froze.

4. When the balls are dirty.

Go ahead and give up some secrets on this thread Freddy. I've bought lots of stuff from you.

blackeee said:

Where do you place the cueball for the break uder the following conditions:

1. New cloth {Somonis 860}

2. Very humid conditions.

3.When you have to rack the balls above the spot to get em froze.

4. When the balls are dirty.

Go ahead and give up some secrets on this thread Freddy. I've bought lots of stuff from you.

Click to expand...

I wont give you the whole run down. But I will give you a big factor you change the speed you hit the cue ball softer or harder. And on new cloth the balls breack easier. So concentrate more on a good hit. Did you know that racking above the spot gives you a better brack. Number 2 and 4 you have to hit the balls harder to breack up. And racking the balls above the head spot gives you a better chance to scratch. Lets her someone else. I know all about the breack. Because I probable stuied it more then anyone.

Never had a great break

Never had a great break

blackeee said:

Where do you place the cueball for the break uder the following conditions:

1. New cloth {Somonis 860}

2. Very humid conditions.

3.When you have to rack the balls above the spot to get em froze.

4. When the balls are dirty.

Go ahead and give up some secrets on this thread Freddy. I've bought lots of stuff from you.

Click to expand...

I seldom had a devastating break, but I always understood the mechanics. Everything Artie said is correct, although I never knew or realized that the balls break better if you rack them higher. I did know that the scratch was more likely if you racked higher, and if you were lax and werent a "checker" that's the rack you would receive from me (with a slight scratch-helping tilt thrown in for good measure). No apologies fellas, life was tough back then. You needed a complete education to beat me in those days.
2. Humid conditions: causes the bed cloth to run slow so you need more force to open the balls. (However, what many dont know is that the cushions are more live when it is humid. The slowing effect of the bed cloth disguises that effect.
Here is a story that fits the above condition: Artie made a game with Jersey Red on table 24. Red gave Artie 10 to 8 and Red took every break in return. The tables, as usual, were soaked, and the small pockets and deep wells didnt help much either. Arthur pounded him pretty good. Red often joked about that match, his great line was that when he broke to his pocket the balls would return and rerack themselves.

the Beard

We usually play on wet tables in the Deep South. This shortens bank angles, and holds CB and OB ball tracks better. In other words, there's less skid. Dirty pool balls compound the problem.

So when playing up North, or in a room that has a good A/C which is left running 24/7, I have to remember that banks go longer, and balls will skid. Any CB squirt will be magnified.

It took me awhile to figure out that, on the break, I have to aim the CB at a fuller hit on the first ball in order to accommodate the skid. Otherwise I end up hitting the second ball full-- usually with a bad outcome.

Otherwise I'm left to blaming failing eyesight for a lousy break...

Doc

gulfportdoc said:

We usually play on wet tables in the Deep South. This shortens bank angles, and holds CB and OB ball tracks better. In other words, there's less skid. Dirty pool balls compound the problem.

So when playing up North, or in a room that has a good A/C which is left running 24/7, I have to remember that banks go longer, and balls will skid. Any CB squirt will be magnified.

It took me awhile to figure out that, on the break, I have to aim the CB at a fuller hit on the first ball in order to accommodate the skid. Otherwise I end up hitting the second ball full-- usually with a bad outcome.

Otherwise I'm left to blaming failing eyesight for a lousy break...

Doc

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If you hit too much ove the first ball you will have a good chance ove scratching. I would like to add to the brack that people dont know that when you split the first two balls. YOU CAN HER IT. Did you know that.

Artie Bodendorfer said:

If you hit too much ove the first ball you will have a good chance ove scratching. I would like to add to the brack that people dont know that when you split the first two balls. YOU CAN HER IT. Did you know that.

Click to expand...

I appreciate the input from all,however my question about cueball positiion was not addressed. I break farther towards the middle of the table on a new cloth and when it is very humid. I don't know if that is right or not, but my break seems much worse than it was 10-15 years ago no matter where I put whitey.

blackeee said:

I appreciate the input from all,however my question about cueball positiion was not addressed. I break farther towards the middle of the table on a new cloth and when it is very humid. I don't know if that is right or not, but my break seems much worse than it was 10-15 years ago no matter where I put whitey.

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I meant I break further from the rail, not close to center table. About a ball or so inside the diamond.

slower the table the harder i break but keep the cue ball near the rail.
same spot, same english, same stroke every time. assuming he doesnt tilt the rack.

blackeee said:

I meant I break further from the rail, not close to center table. About a ball or so inside the diamond.

Click to expand...

Keith,

Are you talking about breaking from here? That is extreme but I've done it in bad conditions like you describe. In high humidity it's usually best to hit the rack thinner. For me anyway. I would keep experimenting with cueball position, speed, and hit on the rack until I found something that worked. There should be no reason for you to break worse than you did 10 years ago.

Also, not to be too obvious but if the balls were dirty I would clean them. And if the balls couldn't be racked on the spot, I'd look to play on another table or rack the balls below the spot.

I've never gambled on a table with new cloth. I always wait a week or two after they are recovered so the unnatural angles that occur off of the rails is eliminated. I don't know how the guys who play in tournaments do it on new cloth all of the time. It would drive me nuts.

Dennis

[CUETABLE]http://CueTable.com/P/?@4AALW4BCpA3CCYA4DCpe4EFbe3FChe4GBjO4HAMA4IAEe3JFSe4KEMO3LBKO3MDvO4NBal3OBJl1PRyd@[/CUETABLE]

Merciful edit by the Beard

Merciful edit by the Beard

Artie Bodendorfer said:

If you hit too much ove the first ball you will have a good chance ove scratching. I would like to add to the brack that people dont know that when you split the first two balls. YOU CAN HER IT. Did you know that.

Click to expand...

If you hit too much of the first ball you will have a good chance of scratching. I would like to add this to the break that most people don't know. When you split the first two balls, YOU CAN HEAR IT! Did anyone know that?

Beard

Cowboy Dennis said:

Keith,

Are you talking about breaking from here? That is extreme but I've done it in bad conditions like you describe. In high humidity it's usually best to hit the rack thinner. For me anyway. I would keep experimenting with cueball position, speed, and hit on the rack until I found something that worked. There should be no reason for you to break worse than you did 10 years ago.

Also, not to be too obvious but if the balls were dirty I would clean them. And if the balls couldn't be racked on the spot, I'd look to play on another table or rack the balls below the spot.

I've never gambled on a table with new cloth. I always wait a week or two after they are recovered so the unnatural angles that occur off of the rails is eliminated. I don't know how the guys who play in tournaments do it on new cloth all of the time. It would drive me nuts.

Dennis

[CUETABLE]http://CueTable.com/P/?@4AALW4BCpA3CCYA4DCpe4EFbe3FChe4GBjO4HAMA4IAEe3JFSe4KEMO3LBKO3MDvO4NBal3OBJl1PRyd@[/CUETABLE]

Click to expand...

Your layout didn't come through Dennis.

blackeee said:

Your layout didn't come through Dennis.

Click to expand...

I've no idea why you can't see it Keith, I see both of them. My original and the one in your post. All I did was move the cueball off the siderail to one ball width from the first diamond.

Maybe CaliRed can help you figure out why the tables don't appear for you.

Dennis

Blackeee, I probably shouldn't comment on this, but here goes. I can't see any effect new cloth would have on where you put the CB or vice-versa. Damp tables change the speed but again why a different spotting of the CB ?
I said I shouldn't comment because I only use overspin on the CB, I'm sure using inside spin on a wet table would seriously effect the hit. Any spin on a wet table isn't advised.
Rod. <--- can hear a click whenever CB hits an OB . LOL

inside english helps keep from a scratch and holds the cue ball into the rack which pushes more towards your hole

beatle said:

inside english helps keep from a scratch and holds the cue ball into the rack which pushes more towards your hole

Click to expand...

Beattle, I'm not arguing that, I don't have ANY trouble breaking the balls. I practically never scratch. I said I probably shouldn't comment. I was just commenting on english on a wet table for BLACKEEE.
Rod. < ---hits a lot of the head ball on the break, very sucessfully I might add.

androd said:

Beattle, I'm not arguing that, I don't have ANY trouble breaking the balls. I practically never scratch. I said I probably shouldn't comment. I was just commenting on english on a wet table for BLACKEEE.
Rod. < ---hits a lot of the head ball on the break, very sucessfully I might add.

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Rod,

You sir should always comment. You showed me your "whacky break" remember? I tried it and liked it. I just don't have a problem with the way I break now so I do not use it. But it might be good for a player having trouble with his break. Maybe you could show it again, or maybe I can find it and re-post it.

Dennis <--- washing his mouth out with Miller Lite as you read this.

Cowboy Dennis said:

Rod,

You sir should always comment. You showed me your "whacky break" remember? I tried it and liked it. I just don't have a problem with the way I break now so I do not use it. But it might be good for a player having trouble with his break. Maybe you could show it again, or maybe I can find it and re-post it.

Dennis <--- washing his mouth out with Miller Lite as you read this.

Click to expand...

Rod hitting the head ball full is no good a lot ove bad things can happen. But if you belive that then go ahead and use it. But for the other people who read this site I want them to know it is not what I would do. And the good players do whatever the do to breack the balls and the do it thier way. But hitting the head ball to full can cause a scratch or a double kiss to push the coe ball to hit the long rail first instead ove the short rail. I write a lot on this site because if someone reads it 100 years from know and people play better and are smarter they will see that someone knew the correct answer. And the can see what people thought back in our days. Just Like the talk about a soft breack playing nine ball and eight ball I did that 45 years ago. And I did it against Moral when I beat him playing eight ball. And Moral shot way better then me. But he forgot how to win. But I just wanted to but that in thier. I could tell you things abut pool and how to win and beat the champions but I will hold it for another time.

Cowboy Dennis said:

Rod,

You sir should always comment. You showed me your "whacky break" remember? I tried it and liked it. I just don't have a problem with the way I break now so I do not use it. But it might be good for a player having trouble with his break. Maybe you could show it again, or maybe I can find it and re-post it.

Dennis <--- washing his mouth out with Miller Lite as you read this.

Click to expand...

Dennis, PLEASE NO, You got me into that discussion in a weak moment. It's very disconcerting to have everyone tell me how to break the balls. I know it's my fault, please forgive me.
Rod. <---when I say hitting a lot of the head ball, I mean I don't split'em. I hate that sound.
PS, I knew I shouldn't have posted, I was just trying to answer Blackeees' question.
PPS; see post above (everyone knows what to do and I'm a idiot.) By the way he's completely wrong.

Cowboy Dennis said:

I've no idea why you can't see it Keith, I see both of them. My original and the one in your post. All I did was move the cueball off the siderail to one ball width from the first diamond.

Maybe CaliRed can help you figure out why the tables don't appear for you.

Dennis

Click to expand...

I was on a diferent computer when I replied to your post Dennis. I was positioning the ball a little closer to the rail than that. However, I cured my problem today. The left side of the table I play on is slightly lower than the right side, hence I break to that pocket. Well, I just lowered the right side ever so slightly, polished the balls and practiced breaking to THAT hole for about an hour. I had a little match this afternoon and broke perfectly every time. Alas, I lost anyway. Also I positioned the cue ball as close to the rail as I could and still bridge comfortably.

blackeee said:

. I had a little match this afternoon and broke perfectly every time. Also I positioned the cue ball as close to the rail as I could and still bridge comfortably.

Click to expand...

Good Job. Keep up the good work.
Rod.