Why Do Diamond Tables Bank Shorter?

Patrick Johnson · Aug 15, 2017

I've always heard that Diamond tables bank shorter than Brunswicks, but never heard a reason. Is it because the rubber's faster/springier? Because the cushion noses are different heights/angles?

Would they bank the same if they had the same rubber?

It's past time we got to the bottom of this.

pj
chgo

jtompilot · Aug 15, 2017

Patrick Johnson said:
I've always heard that Diamond tables bank shorter than Brunswicks, but never heard a reason. Is it because the rubber's faster/springier? Because the cushion noses are different heights/angles?

Would they bank the same if they had the same rubber?

It's past time we got to the bottom of this.

pj
chgo

There's about hundred threads on AZ land on the subject. Red, Blue, new cloth, old cloth, modified red. Oh how my head spins:heh

Dead Empty · Aug 15, 2017

The second

The second

Patrick Johnson said:
I've always heard that Diamond tables bank shorter than Brunswicks, but never heard a reason. Is it because the rubber's faster/springier? Because the cushion noses are different heights/angles?

Would they bank the same if they had the same rubber?

It's past time we got to the bottom of this.

pj
chgo

The cue ball gets pinched slightly under the rail. I forget if it was because of the rail height or the nose. Per RKC when he did my table. Even the angle coming off the nose to the base of the rail can affects banks.

androd · Aug 15, 2017

What does it matter, they just do.

El Chapo · Aug 15, 2017

Somehow I've almost completely avoided diamonds. I've played on diamond bar tables though. I feel like brusnwicks go long, and diamonds are truer (more similar to a billiard table), at least that's the way I see it. Maybe the question is, why do brunswicks go long :heh:heh. I think the reason is in there somewhere though; diamonds are built more similar to billiard tables imo... not sure what the actual difference is bc haven't played too much on them, but higher rails is definitely a possibility.

LSJohn · Aug 16, 2017

El Chapo said:
I feel like brusnwicks go long, and diamonds are truer (more similar to a billiard table), at least that's the way I see it.

That's what I think too. Also, I've heard that the difference is nose angle, even though the center of the noses on both are the same height.

Miller · Aug 16, 2017

Patrick Johnson said:
I've always heard that Diamond tables bank shorter than Brunswicks, but never heard a reason. Is it because the rubber's faster/springier? Because the cushion noses are different heights/angles?

Would they bank the same if they had the same rubber?

It's past time we got to the bottom of this.

pj
chgo

ding. ding. ding......winner.

-miller (asked a lot of questions when he had his red label rails swapped out for blue.....)

OneRock · Aug 16, 2017

The Blue Label editions bank just like Brunswick.

Miller · Aug 16, 2017

OneRock said:
The Blue Label editions bank just like Brunswick.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uHBFiAnpZs

poolisboring · Aug 16, 2017

interesting discussion, all i can say is practice your banks on your table of choice, and they will drop.......

lll · Aug 16, 2017

OneRock said:
The Blue Label editions bank just like Brunswick.

Miller said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uHBFiAnpZs

i have to go with miller on this one peter
if you recall when you came to my house you commented my table (brunswick gc 1or2 ) plays "long"
because you were used to diamonds
the blue labels at shooters definitely bank shorter than my brunswick
i beleive mark would agree they play shorter than the medalists at cunninghams

gulfportdoc · Aug 16, 2017

Patrick Johnson said:
I've always heard that Diamond tables bank shorter than Brunswicks, but never heard a reason. Is it because the rubber's faster/springier? Because the cushion noses are different heights/angles?

Would they bank the same if they had the same rubber?

It's past time we got to the bottom of this. pj chgo

Damn, PJ, I was hoping to learn the answer from YOU. What kind of "science guy" are you, anyway?..

I'm sure that Greg Sullivan could tell us. If all else fails we can ask Jewett..

And I'm in the "GC's bank longer" camp...

~Doc

jtompilot · Aug 16, 2017

OneRock said:
The Blue Label editions bank just like Brunswick.

This is pretty close to a true statement if your playing on a GC4. The GC4 rails are different than the 1, 2, or 3.

Island Drive · Aug 16, 2017

There's a couple things I've noticed. If you have a gearing spin on the obj. ball....it ''takes more'' as its coming off the rail than a GC.
Also, and more importantly on banks than stepping into the shot is stepping into the English of the shot naturally. This cue movement is critical in making banks easier on a Diamond allowing the ball to roll more naturally as it comes off the cushion.

OneRock · Aug 16, 2017

Honestly, I don't recall ever seeing two tables of the exact model play the same except in a tournament venue or a pool room with newly installed tables. GC III's in one pool room play noticeably different that GC III's in another pool room.

It almost always comes down to adjusting to the conditions at hand. If a table plays bad and I can't adjust, I just don't play. That's why I always carry my knitting kit with me.

jtompilot said:
This is pretty close to a true statement if your playing on a GC4. The GC4 rails are different than the 1, 2, or 3.

Patrick Johnson · Aug 16, 2017

Patrick Johnson said:
Is it because ... the cushion noses are different heights/angles?

Miller said:
ding. ding. ding......winner.

-miller (asked a lot of questions when he had his red label rails swapped out for blue.....)

I can see why cushion nose height could make a difference, but can't figure why cushion angle would matter. Any insights?

pj
chgo

OneRock · Aug 16, 2017

Because of the direction in which the rubber compresses then expands.

Patrick Johnson said:
I can see why cushion nose height could make a difference, but can't figure why cushion angle would matter. Any insights?

pj
chgo

Patrick Johnson · Aug 16, 2017

Patrick Johnson said:
I can see why cushion nose height could make a difference, but can't figure why cushion angle would matter. Any insights?

pj
chgo

OneRock said:
Because of the direction in which the rubber compresses then expands.

OK, I buy that. Seems like the rubber would be harder/springier if the top of the cushion is less tilted (more horizontal) - is that the case with Diamonds?

Don't mean to beat a dead horse; just trying to get at the details.

pj
chgo

oldschool1478 · Aug 16, 2017

I own a red label diamond 9ft that I updated to blue label specs.

I AIM one rail banks and kicks using the diamonds on the rail to align with the "mirror table" pockets.
Diamond tables do not bank short for me.

OneRock · Aug 16, 2017

I did hear recently that on the 'red labels' (the ones that bank short), the rubber is either tilted or installed upside down. The latter didn't make sense to me, but the information came indirectly from one of the leading table mechanics in the country.

The red labels tables can be converted to play like the blue labels.

Patrick Johnson said:
OK, I buy that. Seems like the rubber would be harder/springier if the top of the cushion is less tilted (more horizontal) - is that the case with Diamonds?

Don't mean to beat a dead horse; just trying to get at the details.

pj
chgo

Why Do Diamond Tables Bank Shorter?

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