Earl vs justin end game

unoperro · Nov 30, 2016

Earl just left this situation for Justin.Justins pocket is to our left. He needs both balls. Billy thinks banking 2 rails is the only good option. The other commentater thinks just clip the edge of the 11 leave whitey uptable. WWYD

OldSchool · Dec 1, 2016

Either shot is good. Also just wanted to say that I've watched this match, it's a pretty good one, and Justin plays excellent in it.

Old School

LSJohn · Dec 1, 2016

unoperro said:
Earl just left this situation for Justin.Justins pocket is to our left. He needs both balls. Billy thinks banking 2 rails is the only good option. The other commentater thinks just clip the edge of the 11 leave whitey uptable. WWYD

For either Justin it's the bank. For me it's the clip (I've made that bank in the wrong corner pocket too many times.

)

Thanks for posting it.

Island Drive · Dec 1, 2016

LSJohn said:
For either Justin it's the bank. For me it's the clip (I've made that bank in the wrong corner pocket too many times. )

Thanks for posting it.

Coming across the ball on the two rail bank missing the upper corner pocket is sooooo difficult on a diamond. A GC I like my chances. On this table, you probably have ta hit the head rail cushion 6'' from the pocket too make it....then you gotta do it a second time to run the two and out. I'm with ya John, I'd probably pocket the banked ball, at least one of em in the upper corner and sell out.

cincy_kid · Dec 1, 2016

I personally do not shoot that 2 rail bank very well, so for my game, I would avoid that shot. For someone that hits that shot well, it is probably the best shot. I may be too worried that I miss the 15 trying to thin and sell out a spot shot so what I would probably do is just hit the 14 full enough to keep the CB near the foot rail and bring the 14 up high enough not to sell out a cross corner.

Something like this:

Mkbtank · Dec 1, 2016

Earl vs justin end game

I love that two railer, and you're close enough to hit it with some accuracy imo. My concern is more selling out a bank if missed as I am stopping the cue (behind the 11 hopefully). But I think I'm shooting it.

Island Drive · Dec 1, 2016

Mkbtank said:
I love that two railer, and you're close enough to hit it with some accuracy imo. My concern is more selling out a bank if missed as I am stopping the cue (behind the 11 hopefully). But I think I'm shooting it.

The way I'm seein' it Mitch is this. Holding that cue ball on the foot rail seems nearly impossible since you have to create 16 feet of object ball travel. If the table is lightning fast then it's a possibility, but the spin needed to kill whitey on the lower part of the table feels semi extreme. Because of that, I'd feel safer hitting the obj. ball speed to travel 20' to leave it by the side pocket.

Mkbtank · Dec 1, 2016

Earl vs justin end game

Island Drive said:
The way I'm seein' it Mitch is this. Holding that cue ball on the foot rail seems nearly impossible since you have to create 16 feet of object ball travel. If the table is lightning fast then it's a possibility, but the spin needed to kill whitey on the lower part of the table feels semi extreme. Because of that, I'd feel safer hitting the obj. ball speed to travel 20' to leave it by the side pocket.

That makes sense as well Bill. I vacillated between pocket speed and side pocket speed. Depends how the table is playing 2 railers. On GC's in my area, if hit hard the OB will never open up off the second rail. IMO the diamonds at the derby open up like a drunken prom date

.

darmoose · Dec 1, 2016

Mkbtank said:
I love that two railer, and you're close enough to hit it with some accuracy imo. My concern is more selling out a bank if missed as I am stopping the cue (behind the 11 hopefully). But I think I'm shooting it.

Mitch,

As I recall this shot, the players were on a break which afforded the opportunity for plenty of discussion by the commentators before the shot. Dr Bills main thought behind shooting the two railer was that he could "naturally" attain optimum CB position going three rails (short-long-long) to the middle of the head rail, thereby leaving NADA (always a worthwhile goal) should he miss.

I think you have two chances of holding the CB on the foot rail, slim and none.:lol:lol.

Chances of leaving a cross corner bank or a two railer out of the top left corner loom pretty high also. All in all, trying to hold that CB to the bottom rail would not be advisable IMHO. But hey, I could be overthinking this.

Mkbtank · Dec 1, 2016

Earl vs justin end game

darmoose said:
Mitch,

As I recall this shot, the players were on a break which afforded the opportunity for plenty of discussion by the commentators before the shot. Dr Bills main thought behind shooting the two railer was that he could "naturally" attain optimum CB position going three rails (short-long-long) to the middle of the head rail, thereby leaving NADA (always a worthwhile goal) should he miss.

I think you have two chances of holding the CB on the foot rail, slim and none.:lol:lol.

Chances of leaving a cross corner bank or a two railer out of the top left corner loom pretty high also. All in all, trying to hold that CB to the bottom rail would not be advisable IMHO. But hey, I could be overthinking this.

Well since you've seen the outcome, it's pretty easy to post a response without having to think too hard. Lol. So I'll just assume you are correct.

unoperro · Dec 1, 2016

Mkbtank said:
Well since you've seen the outcome, it's pretty easy to post a response without having to think too hard. Lol. So I'll just assume you are correct.

Great discussion but Justin didnt 2 rail anything. Didnt clip anything either! Keep looking

darmoose · Dec 1, 2016

Mkbtank said:
Well since you've seen the outcome, it's pretty easy to post a response without having to think too hard. Lol. So I'll just assume you are correct.

Well, actually, I have no idea at all what was shot, or what the outcome of it was. The only reason I remember this shot is because of the picture and the prolonged analysis and discussion that took place beforehand. You could give me 100:1 on what happened here and I could not take the bet.:frus

However, assume away anyway. As I often tell my grandson, "you will rarely go wrong assuming Grandpa is right".:heh:heh

wincardona · Dec 1, 2016

darmoose said:
Mitch,

As I recall this shot, the players were on a break which afforded the opportunity for plenty of discussion by the commentators before the shot. Dr Bills main thought behind shooting the two railer was that he could "naturally" attain optimum CB position going three rails (short-long-long) to the middle of the head rail, thereby leaving NADA (always a worthwhile goal) should he miss.

I think you have two chances of holding the CB on the foot rail, slim and none.:lol:lol.

Chances of leaving a cross corner bank or a two railer out of the top left corner loom pretty high also. All in all, trying to hold that CB to the bottom rail would not be advisable IMHO. But hey, I could be overthinking this.

Yes and I still stand firm on my suggestion with the two rail option. It's an easy hit playing it short plus the speed of the shot is very easy to judge and there are no kisses. Playing off the 11ball i see problems not so with the two rail option. There's a built in safety with the shot and leaving your olponent on the top rail forcing him to play the length of the table will eventually yield you winning opportunities.

Dr. Bill

LSJohn · Dec 1, 2016

wincardona said:
playing it short

Dr. Bill

Why didn't I think of that.

Good shot.

darmoose · Dec 1, 2016

wincardona said:
Yes and I still stand firm on my suggestion with the two rail option. It's an easy hit playing it short plus the speed of the shot is very easy to judge and there are no kisses. Playing off the 11ball i see problems not so with the two rail option. There's a built in safety with the shot and leaving your olponent on the top rail forcing him to play the length of the table will eventually yield you winning opportunities.

Dr. Bill

Yes, I was very impressed with your thought process on this shot, Bill (as I quite often am). Course, I am a believer in putting a little thought into my game, as I can see, you are.

Seems its true. great minds DO think alike, if I'm not being too presumptuous.

baby huey · Dec 1, 2016

The shot here is player sensitive. By that I mean Justin shoots very unorthodox shots from time to time. It wouldn't surprise me if Justin one rail kicked at the ball on the rail. He is very unpredictable and likes to shoot at the home run. If I was at the table I'd probably just fan the ball on the rail and go two rails up table with the cue ball. But, Justin might not???

lll · Dec 1, 2016

unoperro said:
Great discussion but Justin didnt 2 rail anything. Didnt clip anything either! Keep looking

i will have fun on the computer
he had to shoot this.........

Billy Jackets · Dec 1, 2016

If he didn't thin the 11 or 2 rail the 11 or 14 I would think he shot an inferior shot.
He probably kicked the 11 in and ran out, and now every" fire at yer hole" guy, will think thats the right shot.
I would personally 2 rail the 14 and try to play position on the 11, I would be trying to hit the 14 hard enough to come back just short of the side pocket if I missed.
I think the 14 can be hit fuller than you might think and have a chance to go and stay low, but I play with a deflective shaft.
I wouldn't shoot it with a LD.

lll · Dec 1, 2016

if this is the 2 railer you guys see as one of the shots
(i would clip the 11)
how do you control the cue ball ??

it looks like the back cut will not allow you to hold the cue ball
i am obviously missing something since there is agreement the shot is doable
HELP please..

Mkbtank · Dec 1, 2016

Earl vs justin end game

Did he 4 rail the 11?

Edit: ugh. I have been shooting for the wrong pocket.

.

Ps: you were right again, Grandpa

Earl vs justin end game

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