Efren Reyes vs. Nick Varner 1999 D.C.C. #2

[SJDinPHX]

Larry, trust the Ghost here, not Papie - nobody outmoves a ghost.....

Papie's recommended next shot - grazing the 15ball (which is actually the 11 ball - tell him again Dennis, and going down to the end rail, that he says is the best choice, is not the best choice (might be second best) - it's extremely unlikely that Efren would be trapped by that shot...i.e. if you hit the 15 ball a fraction too thick you scratch in the corner - hit it slightly too slow or too fast and you leave an easy return safety: by coming off the side of the 10 to the long rail and dropping behind the 13, or by softly kicking the 4 ball....with Papie's shot, you'd have to have the cueball end up pin-point perfect to double him up with the 3ball, and even then, Efren wouldn't be trapped - he could just come off of the 6 ball and drop behind the 4 ball...

And I don't care what Nick shoots here either.....the place you want to get the cueball to in this spot, is in the area where Rod proposed/positioned it - on the opposite long rail, from 1 to 2 diamonds up from Efren's pocket - that's the place where the guy is trapped....but I wouldn't risk trying to get there via Rod's shot - too tough - you're shooting off the rail - way too much chance of having the cueball hit the 14 ball, or accidentally shooting the banked ball into the pocket points, or kissing the banked ball...instead, the way to get to Rod's spot on the long rail is by using...

...the old-school-intentional-scratch as an offensive weapon (as Freddy and I are great proponents of)....that said, if the 6 ball isn't in the way for me to get as short as I need to, I'd go 3 rails to get there - if the 6 is in the way, second choice is I'll shoot between the 4 ball and the long rail with 2-tips of right english, to the head rail and back to get there...unlike shooting from the head rail, from here, the shooter can't see the 11,12, 13, or 4 ball, and he's in big trouble.

- Ghost

PS, And Papie, don't be stubborn, please man-up and admit that I'm right, so that Larry and others that are on here to learn will receive the correct instructional information...

Mr. Groates,

You have managed to poo-poo two very playable shots...Mine and Rod's, in your never ending quest to be right...If you are not capable of hitting the 11 ball, thin enough, when you are that close to it, then it is your shortcoming. I could shoot it 100 times, and not scratch. (so could an APA 2 or 3)...Also I would put it in the exact right spot ( very close to the rail) 80-85% of the time. Maybe the shot is just too advanced for you..?.

If you shot Rod's shot, and hit the point with the OB..Then, maybe you just jumped too high, once again.. I am beginning to think, that you approach every shot, like an amatuer golfer, who sees nothing but sand traps and water, and never the green..By the way, have you always had the "yips" ?.. (see Cooney vs Perry..1994 Open, in Mi)
..In 1994, I was 60 yrs. old...Jack passed on playing me then, and waited 'til I was 68, and he still couldn't get there, giving me 9/8..Do your homework, before you get too critical of my shot selection.

Next I suppose you'll say Efren shot the right shot, by winding up there in the first place.

I'm starting to think, if I were able to stand up steadily, and practiced for about 20 minutes, you would STILL have your hands full, trying to beat me...

SuperDuck <---has only lost about 5 ball's of speed, in the past few years, but he still knows how to move, with anyone !..Get over it..

 

[One Pocket Ghost]

Mr. Groates,

You have managed to poo-poo two very playable shots...Mine and Rod's, in your never ending quest to be right...If you are not capable of hitting the 11 ball, thin enough, when you are that close to it, then it is your shortcoming. I could shoot it 100 times, and not scratch. (so could an APA 2 or 3)...Also I would put it in the exact right spot ( very close to the rail) 80-85% of the time. Maybe the shot is just too advanced for you..?.

I'm starting to think, if I were able to stand up steadily, and practiced for about 20 minutes, you would STILL have your hands full, trying to beat me...

SuperDuck <---has only lost about 5 ball's of speed, in the past few years, but he still knows how to move, with anyone !..Get over it..

Oh well, I tried to get you to do the right thing and admit the truth - but I didn't think you would.....

And don't try and twist it by cosying up to Rod and saying I "poo-pooed" Rod's shot...on the contrary, Rod knew as I do, that getting the cueball to that spot on the long rail is much stronger than sending the cueball up-table as you incorrectly suggest.....

And, moving on...You know what?...since you, and I'm saying this with all due respect, can't shoot well enough anymore (neither can I by the way)...but, you think you can out-move me (and I don't think that anyone can out-move me ) - well, I just thought of...

* THE ABSOLUTE PERFECT GAME FOR US *...the game being >>>

Since you can out-move me, and since Fast Lenny, your foster son, with his young eyes, can out-shoot me 2-1...

You can coach him, and he and I will play even/heads up...so being out-moved by you, (except I won't be, because you can't out-move me ) and being out-shot by Lenny, I know I have the worst of it - but I will play...

Let's say, a race to 4 or 5 or 6 games for $1,000 - at the DCC...

Do I have action Mr. Duckmorran?...

- Gho$ty

 

[One Pocket Ghost]

...postscript for any curious onepocket.org members...

...20 minutes ago I checked out Papie's current onepocket.org activity and it said he was responding to my last post/challenge in this thread...but he never posted that response, and he logged off instead...

...me-thinks maybe he postponed posting and went to call/confer with Lenny to tell him that he has lock-action for the two of them against me! - I don't blame him - I'd love it too, if somebody offered me easy action like that......

...gotta hit the sack now, I'm still a working stiff after all...I'll see Papie's response in the morning...

- Ghost

 

[SJDinPHX]

Oh well, I tried to get you to do the right thing and admit the truth - but I didn't think you would...

And don't try and twist it by saying I "poo-pooed" Rod's shot...on the contrary, Rod knows as I do, that getting the cueball to that spot on the long rail is much stronger than sending it up-table as you incorrectly suggest..

And you know what?...since you, and I'm saying this with all due respect, can't shoot well enough anymore (neither can I by the way)...but, you think you can out-move me (and I don't think that anyone can out-move me
- well, I just thought of...

THE ABSOLUTE PERFECT GAME FOR US ...the game being >>>

Since you can out-move me, and since Fast Lenny, your foster son, with his young eyes, can out-shoot me 2-1...

You can coach him, and he and I will play even/heads up...so being out-moved by you, (except I won't be, because you can't out-move me )and out-shot by Lenny, I know I have the worst of it - but I will play...

Let's say, a race to 4 or 5 or 6 games for $1,000 - at the DCC...

Do I have action Mr. Duckmorran?...

- Ghosty

Thank you for your generous offer.... Lenny is learning fast, but his cue ball, and speed control is lacking quite a bit yet...However, I would take almost any other local 9 baller, say Mitch Ellerman (who can't even spell one pocket) or Preacher Ronn, or Gus Briseno, Eric Young, Bobby Emmonds, Chuck Evan's (or a host of other's) and try you on for a few sets...You will need to find a little fatter stakehorse though Goatsy...Not trying to high roll YOU...Just your stakehorse..

Sad news (again)...It is looking like I may be AWOL again this year. I can no longer fly, and despite not feeling that great, Lenny and I were going to drive back to the 'iceberg', called Indiana...Now it seems he can't make it.

Unless I can find a 'suitable' replacement, its not looking good...But you can still get some of my $$$$ via playing John H. or Bernie, or maybe letting one of them coach one of the aforementioned player's..Belly up big boy...

SuperDuck <---Will find a way to get us in action, somehow (if you ain't askeered)..

 

[SJDinPHX]

...postscript for any curious onepocket.org members...

...20 minutes ago I checked out Papie's current onepocket.org activity and it said he was responding to my last post/challenge in this thread...but he never posted that response, and he logged off instead...

...me-thinks maybe he postponed posting and went to call/confer with Lenny to tell him that he has lock-action for the two of them against me! - I don't blame him - I'd love it too, if somebody offered me easy action like that......

...gotta hit the sack now, I'm still a working stiff after all...I'll see Papie's response in the morning...

- Ghost

As you can see, I never logged off, (responded at 11:22)... YOU went off line so you could lurk, and think up a reply for tomorrow ?...Is it getting a little too warm for you..Better go nighty- night:.:lol:lol:sorry

 

[Skin]

I think I'll move the 6 over to my long rail and go up and down with the cb to a little above the second diamond from his hole.

Skin

 

[tonygreen]

I'm too tired to look and see who mentioned this shot but here is what Efren shot after getting down on the 3 ball three times and getting back up each time. I guess he saw something he didn't like.

View attachment 4231

Here's how he left it:

View attachment 4232

I mentioned something 91 percent similar to this (LOL) , but people here get so carried away (mostly with their own pridefullness) this forum is full of cliques.

No encouragement for new members c'est la vie (life sucks) ... I surely wont be around for long, maybe the group will keep more than 15 % ofthe next new 100 members.

 

[lll]

i think one way to look at it is which leave has a larger window for success
(ease of execution/precision speed control to get the q ball there) and degree of "trapness"

if you could double him up AND leave the distance its a great shot
BUT
i think the leave on the long rail has both a larger area it would be effective AND puts him in trouble
so im more with ghost and rod and skin
as far as where would i want to leave the q
( i know dick i still have alot to learn)
skins shot also gets the 6 on his side
with less traffic to navigate like rods shot
ghost it looks to me the 3 ball blocks the lane to where you want to get to on the 4th rail so i would come off the short rail with english as you described
i like skins shot best so far

 

[tylerdurden]

View attachment 4234
i think one way to look at it is which leave has a larger window for success
(ease of execution/precision speed control to get the q ball there) and degree of "trapness"

if you could double him up AND leave the distance its a great shot
BUT
i think the leave on the long rail has both a larger area it would be effective AND puts him in trouble
so im more with ghost and rod and skin
as far as where would i want to leave the q
( i know dick i still have alot to learn)
skins shot also gets the 6 on his side
with less traffic to navigate like rods shot
ghost it looks to me the 3 ball blocks the lane to where you want to get to on the 4th rail so i would come off the short rail with english as you described
i like skins shot best so far

am i the only one that likes taking a scratch 2 rails hopefully near this ball near middle diamond end rail? maybe ill get lucky and hit it too hard and freeze him on that 14.

i'm sure i'm crazy, but all those uptable shots look like they will give him easy bunts out of the trap. if i did go uptable it would be off that red stripe (11?) to open those 2 balls. but id be looking for him to come off that 10 and freeze me on that end rail ball near my hole after that if i didnt get him with the 3, not good

 

[lll]

Probably off the 15, and send the cue ball, to the side rail, to the end rail near the RH upper corner pocket, trying to double him (Efren) on the 3 ball...Its a no brainer......Plus, you will open up another ball for yourself, and you will not graze the 15, hard enough to even get to the 9 ball...Mr. Varner should surely see this option...Rod's shot, is also another good option to trap...I just prefer the distance.

PS..Nick would not have had any of these options, had Efren gotten the 3 near his hole (or in)...Its all about risk/reward, in that situation..JMHO.. (but I'm not wrong)...Be interesting to see what he shot...

tyler is this ^^^what you mean without the intentional??

 

[fred bentivegna]

I confirmed...

I confirmed...

I mentioned something 91 percent similar to this (LOL) , but people here get so carried away (mostly with their own pridefullness) this forum is full of cliques.

No encouragement for new members c'est la vie (life sucks) ... I surely wont be around for long, maybe the group will keep more than 15 % ofthe next new 100 members.

...that you did suggest the same shot as Efren. Nothing really wrong with the shot. If I could make a suggestion Tony, your choices would be better served if you figured out how to use the WEI table or be able to add lines and arrows to the images shown.

But do not feel like the Lone Ranger. Myself and the Ghost almost never receive the proper acknowledgement for the one pocket gold that we contribute to the forum. :sorry How would you like to be the world's smartest bank pool player and the number 2 smartest one pocket player and still have nobody pay much attn to you?

Yes, there are cliques. But I will talk to the Ghost so that we can get you enrolled in our clique. The powerful Chicago connection.:heh

Beard

 

[ChrisBanks]

...that you did suggest the same shot as Efren. Nothing really wrong with the shot. If I could make a suggestion Tony, your choices would be better served if you figured out how to use the WEI table or be able to add lines and arrows to the images shown.

But do not feel like the Lone Ranger. Myself and the Ghost almost never receive the proper acknowledgement for the one pocket gold that we contribute to the forum. :sorry How would you like to be the world's smartest bank pool player and the number 2 smartest one pocket player and still have nobody pay much attn to you?

Yes, there are cliques. But I will talk to the Ghost so that we can get you enrolled in our clique. The powerful Chicago connection.:heh

Beard

Freddy,

Don't worry, I've written down just about everything you've posted here regarding one pocket. And I've even written your name down next to it so you get credit should I show it to anyone else.

 

[androd]

I mentioned something 91 percent similar to this (LOL) , but people here get so carried away (mostly with their own pridefullness) this forum is full of cliques.

No encouragement for new members c'est la vie (life sucks) ... I surely wont be around for long, maybe the group will keep more than 15 % ofthe next new 100 members.

Yes, there are cliques. But I will talk to the Ghost so that we can get you enrolled in our clique. The powerful Chicago connection.

Tony. toughen up, you picked the same shot as Efren. Now you're in a clique with Curly and Moe.
Rod.
P.S. Another ego is always welcome.
P.P.S. Tell us what you'd do about the next situation

 

[SJDinPHX]

=skin
I think I'll move the 6 over to my long rail and go up and down with the cb to a little above the second diamond from his hole.

Skin

Thats another plausable shot Skin...What seems to have been lost here, all goes back to Efren NOT shooting the 3 ball, and creating a threat ball...As was proposed by most on this board, as the shot they would have shot. As did even your "average moving" homie, Goatsy... see post #16)

It all boils down to that...Had he chosen to cut the 3, all those other return options, distance vs side rail trap, would have become a moot point... I must say however, the Goatsy's first choice shot (for Efren), was a wild, full table, off the rail, panic shot,.... relying almost strictly on luck for success.(**)

I wonder why he was the ONLY one touting that shot..Must be the sheer genius in him..:lol

If he wants to take credit for being the first to come up with cutting the 3, Let him have it.. Just remember, he called it a "2nd choice" conservative shot..

View attachment 4236 (**) <<<<<<<<

 

[tonygreen]

Tony. toughen up, you picked the same shot as Efren. Now you're in a clique with Curly and Moe.
Rod.
P.S. Another ego is always welcome.
P.P.S. Tell us what you'd do about the next situation

Thanks Androd ... but i will decline (because I will certainly be wrong)

 

[lll]

...that you did suggest the same shot as Efren. Nothing really wrong with the shot. If I could make a suggestion Tony, your choices would be better served if you figured out how to use the WEI table or be able to add lines and arrows to the images shown.

But do not feel like the Lone Ranger. Myself and the Ghost almost never receive the proper acknowledgement for the one pocket gold that we contribute to the forum. :sorry How would you like to be the world's smartest bank pool player and the number 2 smartest one pocket player and still have nobody pay much attn to you?

Yes, there are cliques. But I will talk to the Ghost so that we can get you enrolled in our clique. The powerful Chicago connection.:heh

Beard

tony if you read post 5 frank almanza the barber diagrammed the shot
jtompilot made a comment in post #12
be careful about the chicago connection
once they let you in they dont let you out

 

[SJDinPHX]

I mentioned something 91 percent similar to this (LOL) , but people here get so carried away (mostly with their own pridefullness) this forum is full of cliques.

No encouragement for new members c'est la vie (life sucks) ... I surely wont be around for long, maybe the group will keep more than 15 % ofthe next new 100 members.

Mr. Green.

If you hang around long enough, you will find that these "shot selection" threads, usually wind up in a friendly (most times)..."battle of wits, and egos"...Most find it amusing, and some may actually learn something of value..It is rarely terminal. (or resolved)

Sorry you have such a negative view of our shenanigans...Perhaps you would be more comfortable over on one of AZB's "Aiming System" threads, where everybody really "enjoys" [sic] the friendly banter, without anyone EVER getting upset, or killed...(that I know of)
...However, there have been a few close calls.....:sorry

SuperDuck <---Hopes you'll stick around long enough to see the Duck, easily move Goatsy into a coma...

 

[jtompilot]

As a neutral party I offer my services (25% fee) as Duckies shooter since I dont play Gus or Mitch's speed but I aint bad.

 

[MARK..HOU TX]

Hey Tony .. Next time you pick a shot .. try Jim Beam ..but not to many or you'll sell out

 

[SJDinPHX]

As a neutral party I offer my services (25% fee) as Duckies shooter since I dont play Gus or Mitch's speed but I aint bad.

Jtom,

I could add your name (or almost anyone, who can stop their rock)...But we shall have to wait until Goatsy wakes up...(usually at the crack of noon)... Hope he reads all the pertinent posts..Sometimes he forgets, what he said...