you both need one

[Dennis "Whitey" Young]

You get it out good, but he's got the kick bank to his hole depending on how the balls lay. Try the same shot, but instead of inside, use bottom outside and let the cue ball go three rails back to the bottom rail. The object ball goes up around the top right corner.

Yes, the shot is not protected from the return kick, thanks for pointing that out!
On the other shot you are suggesting to try, I am respectfully disagreeing, but that shot is impossible.
I brought this up to Bob's attention on another thread. He replied that he thought all of his diagrammed shots were possible with max spin. But this, no way!
http://onepocket.org/forum/index.php?attachments/croppercapture-97-jpg.432504/

But, below is the result I get when doing this take out shot, and making the cb go around 3 rails and back to the opponents hole. As you can see it is impossible to get the ob two rails to the head rail as per diagram, and still make the cb go around 3 rails. For I can barely get it past the side pocket. The PV in this instance experienced some kind of failure.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/5iXV3CbU9vJx15EA6

Thanks for bringing this up! We really enjoy Bob's PV diagrams and they are also very helpful in transferring the image to an overhead image. I believe the PV is very good, it is just in this instance something must of went awry. Whitey

 

[lll]

Whitey
Your results were similar to mine

 

[Billy Jackets]

https://photos.app.goo.gl/S84Bb7UPuj4HkXTj8 A beautiful shot wonderfully getting out of the kiss.
Larry, I believe this shot rivals the kick shot you like. Plus it baits the opponent to try and bank towards his hole, which is a kiss. You do have to be mindful that you could pocket the ob in the upper corner pocket, so speed is a concern. But I play the ob speed vs. playing the cb, for the cb will be ok if you get the ob into that sweat spot.
I did not share before because I was trying to do to much with this shot, and I felt I was leaving a return bank, but I revisited it and smooth out and simplified the stroke, and now got the desired results. Enjoy, Whitey

You hit the shot perfectly Whitey but the rail first kick bank. is not difficult at all, that close to the rail. One of my mentors almost never missed that shot.

 

[Dennis "Whitey" Young]

BR & Billy Jackets, thanks, in conclusion the two rail kick into the 6 and driving the 6 to 2 + diamonds on the opposite foot long rail, w/ leaving the cb on the foot end rail, is the better shot, and the #1 shot!
From that position it is hard to go offensive, as far as I can figure out. So then, what do you guys think, the reply is to just bank the 6 kitty corner up by the head right corner pocket, correct!
I've tried to 2 rail the 6 from there but it is hard to get the cb to go out of the area.
Whitey

 

[baby huey]

It's hard to know which safety to play in these situations. I personally like the kick behind the ball and send the object ball to my side by the side pocket. It boils down to which shot you've practiced and the results you've acheived. I don't like taking the ball out hitting the short rail first, although doable, sometimes you leave a return safety which will put you in trouble. The other safety is to hit the top of the object ball thin with inside english and send it two rails to your side and the cueball comes back towards your opponents side,

 

[Billy Jackets]

Ok , lets look at what shot we shoot if we hit the ball short perfectly, the way wincardona suggested. Imagine that the cueball is frozen to the bottom rail where the object ball now is, and the object ball goes to the diamond below the side pocket frozen, probably one of the best things you could hope for in this situation.
Any place you bank the ball to the other side, above the side pocket , , either leaves a 1 rail off the top rail or a 3 railer ...except if the ball gets right in front of the pocket , correct?
So that shot is probably no good.
I think you have to cut the ball thinly toward your upper corner pocket and make sure you don't make it. I don't see many options I like.

 

[cincy_kid]

Ok , lets look at what shot we shoot if we hit the ball short perfectly, the way wincardona suggested. Imagine that the cueball is frozen to the bottom rail where the object ball now is, and the object ball goes to the diamond below the side pocket frozen, probably one of the best things you could hope for in this situation.
Any place you bank the ball to the other side, above the side pocket , , either leaves a 1 rail off the top rail or a 3 railer ...except if the ball gets right in front of the pocket , correct?
So that shot is probably no good.
I think you have to cut the ball thinly toward your upper corner pocket and make sure you don't make it. I don't see many options I like.

From there I would try to bank the ob to my opponent long rail with inside English so that the end result would be cb and ob are across from each other as equally as I could get them.